Menuett für Klavier in D dur op. 162

hello,

just posting this short minuet in D major for piano.

hope you like it

SoundClick artist: Guglielmo Esposito - Contemporary classical music, 18th and 19th century music, style like Mozart and Beethoven

Oh my! Isn't this nice! The form and character are perfect, and it reminds me of the early keyboard minuets of Mozart, as well as some early Latin American music.

Some really lovely surprises in this piece, particularly in the second strophe - namely the deceptive cadence in B minor, and the chromaticism both leading up to it and just after it before you tie it up in a bow with that lovely little flourish into the cadence. Very imaginative.

If I may, I'd like to make some suggestions and admonitions.

There are a few things I think you could have done better. For example, I think the bass line in the first four measures of the second strophe could have been a bit more imaginative and even melodic; there is a time and place for repeated notes in the bass, but not at this point, and not really in a piece like this where two parts have to imply a whole harmonic structure. I'd have done something like this:



Not saying you have to do it, but just throwing it out there. Note how in the second measure of the example there is a point of imitation in the bass, following what the treble had just done. This sort of thing is very desirable.

Another place where there is a problem - actually an error according to traditional harmony - is in measure 7 (first strophe), where you have an incident of hidden parallel octaves from beat 1 to beat 2. Here is what you have written (measures 5 through 8, first strophe):



Notice how in measure 3 of the example the 2nd quaver of beat 1 in the treble and the crotchet on beat 1 of the bass both move from E to D. This is parallel octaves and is forbidden in traditional harmony - particularly in a style like this. I'm assuming you'd rather not do something forbidden if you're writing this traditionally.

One of many ways you might get out of a situation like this, even a little artistically:



In measure 1 of the example I made a minor alteration in the bass to set this up better, changing the A on beat 3 to a B. The descending scale in the bass in measure 2 of the example, in contrary motion with the treble, is something very desirable, and the melody and overall harmonic character you intended are preserved. Again, I'm not suggesting that you do this, but that you keep it in mind for the future. Watch your voice leading, and you'd do well to remember that parallel octaves and fifths are to be avoided in this style.

Very nice!

wow, i am amazed! i thought i left a score and u took parts, but i didnt! that's very a good job, well the melody is easy too. i'm impressed

yeah, just now, thanks to you i noticed those parallel octaves, and thanks to provide me those nice resolutions!

but hmm didn't you do just the same as me?? hehe in your example you have above my melody in the 3rd bar and ur new bass line... the last 2 beats of the mass line D E move in the same way and on the first beat of the melody, which does D E too :p

anyway thank you very much for listening to my works!

btw i really loved your sinfonia... id just say that maybe it is too fast played, you should slower a bit the time... like instead of let's say 140... go for 132 or 130. will sound more naturally allegro, than that...

ok, i reworked it.. and adjusted some things... you can see them in the pdf under the link to my piece

Hey! That works just fine. I just printed it out and played it on the harpsichord. It's fun to play.

but hmm didn't you do just the same as me?? hehe in your example you have above my melody in the 3rd bar and ur new bass line... the last 2 beats of the mass line D E move in the same way and on the first beat of the melody, which does D E too :p

I don't think so. Because there is an intervening note (the B quaver in the melody), the similiarity of movement is allowed and it's not considered parallel. It's only when there is no intervening note that there is a problem. That is my understanding of the rule, anyway. I believe early on there were some musicologists and composers who believed one should avoid any movement like this, but that relaxed. Your solution is just fine - as I said, there are many possible ways out of it.

i see, well, using gradus ad parnassum of Fux, that is said that even if there's the 3rd in those 2 notes, the thing is that the main note is still D and E and since the bass does the same, then you hear paralle octaves, that's why i said that, but also on new books, i read that thing, it makes it sound less bad, since those 2 jumping notes are part of those chords, then they can let you "pass" the mistake, so hmm on the first one it is better to avoid, on the second one, you can have them.. so.. if ihave no solutions, ill take them hehe

glad you like this little piece :p if you check my page, there are many things you can listen to, if you didn't yet. hope you enjoy them, and thanks again for your time!

ciao ciao

oh i forgot to ask you a favour, could you please record yourself playing it? i'd like to listen to it played on your harpsichord! you'd make me really happy

What? Fux says that's illegal? That's pretty surprising. I studied Fux extensively a few years ago, but I don't remember him admonishing against that. Probably because stuff like that happens all over classical period music, and as you observed, later theorists made it permissible. I'll take your word for it, though. One learns something new every day (or relearns something one forgot).

At times like this, it's pretty easy to see why later composers wanted to throw these rules to the winds, isn't it?

When I get a chance, I'll see if I can make a recording. I could do it on harpsichord, fortepiano or clavichord (I'm an early keyboard junkie).

haha great! hmm dunno... them all??? maybe im asking too much! but yeah i love to play those instrumetns too

i usually go to a piano shop near where i live, it has all kinds of pianos, petrof, bosendorfer, stainway, stainweg, schultz pollman, etc... and some of them are old, like early 20th century or late 19th...

he lets me play all them, and sometimes ppl ask me to play pianos because they want to buy them... so i tip them which one sounds better in whic room etc... its fun!


but the best thing is that he has a nice spinetta, it has such a small keyboard, but i love it!

oh, when i was in LA i was used to go to a pianoshop in Larchmont, he sells just blutner.. he is a great man and has some nice pianos too, and i loved them all.. if you are nearby, go visit him, he has good things!
i played his pianos, all them.... too fun!
some where enough close i could play 2 pianos at once, was fun too!

ah, btw... (im sure you noticed) my music, ALL of it, is lowered 1 semitune but i wish i could import in finale some of the old temperaments so to play music more like the way i want it to be played, but oh well... it still sounds good

do you have any idea how to make that possible??