"Metus" Overture

Oh Damn it Mael!

I absolutely adored the entire thing, i can literally feel the jeebies jumping in my stomach!

HOWEVER! From page 68, i would probably consider that your coda/finale? am i right?
If not, I felt that from the forte pick up on that page (bar 458-end) was your finale.

So then i was like, woohoo, here we go...its gonna be an awesome finish...and then...I got to the last 2 pages...and yes, good idea to have the timpani roll us out, but...it was soo...like...ARGH, come on!!! SMITE ME ALREADY!!!!!
haha
I'm not saying it was terrible, Im just saying that I wish the final was more thicker, and awesomer than it is now.


Other than that, I can't offer any technical advice. But can I say: if this were to introduce an opera/ballet...it would be one of those overtures that completely outshine the rest of the show.
Frig! you are awesome!

If this doesn't get you fame one day, I don't know what will.

Kudos!

Originally Posted by maelstromtempest

I am wondering if the orchestration is a little bit too thick and the melody lines are too covered up. However, I know that in real life, these lines would be brought out by the players.

Let me just comment on this one line:

Do NOT expect the musicians to pick up on where the major thematic material is and "bring it out".

Orchestrate your densities. If your theme is in a single flute, against the rest of a symphony, no matter HOW memorable that theme is, it WILL be lost.

If your thematic material is important, ORCHESTRATE it as though it were important.

NEVER rely on the musicians' ability to "bring out a theme".
ALWAYS write as though you will not be at ANY rehearsals and the musicians playing are from the Special Ed. class of your local high school.

Do not over indicate dynamic differences... orchestrate them instead.

If you have different dynamics in a passage for every part of the orchestra it is a SURE sign that you did not orchestrate properly.

Remember that a forte flute does not sound the same as a piano flute. If the passage is marked piano for everyone but that flute is marked forte, the sound will NOT be "soft with a flute coming out of the mix".. it will sound like a flautist blowing his brains out while everyone else is relaxing.

I just need to repeat one thing:

Orchestrate your effects. Do not just write dynamics and expect that to work. Balance the right amounts of instruments against each other for whatever role they have in the final orchestration.

I second what Qcc and Gardener said. Though, I'm more of the opinion that you should as well write ALL dynamic indications where you want the dynamic to change, etc etc, or people aren't going to have a clue on how to play stuff or there'll be stupid questions popping up every four bars.

Though yeah, orchestra usage could be better.

Thank you for you replies!
I understand what you three have said, and this post is going to sound wrong, but it is true.

That line earlier was just stupid of me to say! I was talking about the midi distortion, but I guess I didn't explain it properly in the thread. Sorry!

(This is the wrong part) I wrote the score as it is now for playback in midi. I know that this is completely and totally wrong, but midi doesn't really compensate for strong/weak ranges. I am under the assumption that to find a way to bring this out, the dynamics had to be different. I am confident that the parts are orchestrated in a way that will bring out the themes. If I am wrong, can you please point some parts out?

As part of the process of making the score ready, I HAVE MADE THE DYNAMICS UNIFORM LIKE THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE. (The reason why I posted a score, though unfinished, is due to requests in earlier threads "Always post a PDF")

I really enjoyed it. As most people have already said, it sounds a lot like Beethoven. I really like your grasp of late-classical style. I think you might have used tutti sections a little too much though. A theme like anxiety might have lent itself to some subdued but tense parts, not that you don't have some now. I kinda agree with Goodridge; the ending seems really drawn out. Excellent job overall though.

Beethoven is a bit outside my experience in terms of understanding what it is the man does, but I can comment on the emotions this piece evokes in me.

Although parts of it are indeed very dramatic (to good effect), this piece maintains an air of regality and dignity. It is very well executed.

I'm also glad to see this piece has received such excellent advice.

Got an mp3 handy?

that was really good. That was so far beyond me........i don't know.

Amazing. I don't think I noticed anything wrong with it (I'm still new). The dynamics were amazing also. I was caught off guard every time it got really loud. Turned up speakers.....POW.... had to turn them down again. Excellent.

I could listen to that over and over! I probably will, too.

The piece is very big and lush in the way of harmony and orchestration, and I like your use of the winds and strings. You made use of the themes and motifs in a way that let them develop throughout the piece while still being recognizable, which is part of the reason that your overture is one of the best pieces you've posted. Even with that, though, I think you could have done more with texture and counterpoint, and you sometimes used the percussion uneccessarily, imo. It's a pretty classical piece, and it's well thought out. It's long, but not too much so, and it's one of the better pieces you've posted, like I said.

Good job. That's my first thing to say. I don't know how much experience you have composing, but this certainly is full of life and has a good musical shape and flow to it.
Also kudos on finishing a large score.
Now I'm afraid I'm going to have to rip it apart in a small, kind way. I hope.

First of all - Orchestration.
OK, now you say this is written for your high school orchestra. How good is this orchestra? A lot of this is really rather difficult writing. I know your signature says you play the violin, but for a high school orchestra (unless it's a massive, and v. talented school) these violin parts are pretty much impossible, and certainly impractical.
Also, does the orch. have 4 timpani?
More points:
Things like tenuto marks on semiquavers in a fast tempo.....They will either be totally ignored, or they will actually cause the part to be played less well. So you'll have to make a decision - is the mark necessary? (Again, my comments are for a high school orch.)
There's a place where you have mf and leggiero marked on the same part. This is the same sort of thing again....a conflict of interests. mp might be more efficiently taken in by the players.
All these things are in the interests of getting as good a performance as possible with the few rehearsals that you will probably have.

Just a few notes on harmony:
Sometimes you have moving parts in one group of instruments, and harmony in another, and the two conflict. Sometimes the groups just aren't quite in agreement about the overall harmony. Be sure that you know what each chord is supposed to be; that all passing notes do pass (and end up on a consonance); and that all the groups of instruments agree (are playing the same basic harmony).
There are a few harmonic progressions which are awkward. This'll improve with more study.
Try not to leave bare fifths - they work only very rarely. (E.g., opening of Beethoven's 9th)
Try to use chord inversions based on logical bass motion. Be sure you know what inversion each chord is in.
Let sevenths fall by step.

OK, now I'll make a few comments just going through the score chronologically.

Btw, I thought the piece was quite well linked through with that dotted motive.

Anyway:
page 3. Don't divide your 'cello and double bass so much - they should primarily be in unison (sounding octaves).
Bar 19 - that D# in the tpt. (sounding C#) conflicts with the harmony. Bar 20-21 the C in the tpt. is a seventh, and, like all dissonances, sevenths have to fall stepwise.
There's some harmonic confusion pages 10-11.
Bar 84 - open 5th is a little ugly.
Page 20 - the bassoon solo is slightly ungainly, and some of the surrounding harmony is confused.
Bar 160 - the C major here would work better in root position. (Having the G in the bass is causing the dissonance of the 4th from the bass to higher parts)
Bar 208 - con brio is a little ambiguous here. Perhaps something less often associated with tempo, con fuoco maybe. Either way, it's not a typical marking to put there....likely that players won't all be doing the same thing - mixed signals, resulting in a weak overall impression.
Just as I'm at about page 32 I should make another instrumentation note. These sudden 'stabs' - where everyone comes out of silence to play one accented note.... those will be hard for the amateur orchestra to play successfully, and together. Especially if they're coming in on a high note, which they sometimes are. You can hardly get rid of these though - they're important to the piece, but I'd personally go easy on such things writing for a high school orch.
Page 35 - again, 4ths in bass. That pedal in the double bass provides perhaps *too much* stasis. The melodic figure in the dbl bass would be better doubled with the 'cello.
Page 39 - not sure how good your vlns are, but F#s are high, and very likely to be out of tune, especially in a moving passage like this.
Bar 274 - Pllel 5ths in winds.
Page 41 - use simile instead of sempre here.
Page 43,44 - a bit of harmonic confusion.
Bar 307 - bare fifths.
Page 54 - some nice modulations. The build up to here was good.
Till the end is mostly the same. There are a couple of bits where the timp. part is implying the wrong inversion of the chord, a couple of dynamics issues, but mostly fine.
Also, pages 7-8 - I would not entrust that melodic figure to the viola, as violas are almost always understaffed and poorly played in student orchestras.

OK, that's me done commenting.
Sorry I've been so critical, but if you're getting a performance, I believe all these things will help to make it successful - which is what it's all about.
I like the piece overall.. it definitely has potential, and already shows a good musical feeling. You just need to work on harmony a bit (esp. learning to use dissonances correctly), and maybe make the orchestration a bit easier for a high school orch. to play.

Good luck with the performance.

Hey very nice piece so impressive. If i would have a suggestion is that maybe in some parts i notice melodies kind of "serious" or "elegant" that you give to oboe, wich makes it sounds something comic. I would change this lines to other instrument, say flute maybe clarinet or horn. Im so glad to hear this.

Bravo!!!