Jump to content

Major vs Minor


finrod

Do you prefer a Major or Minor key signature?  

1 member has voted

  1. 1. Do you prefer a Major or Minor key signature?

    • Major
      10
    • Minor
      37
    • I like atonal music
      7
    • I'm not 100% sure
      14


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 67
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Guest QcCowboy

Niko, while I totally agree with you that major does NOT necessarily mean "happy" (and vice versa), I'd point out that while the piano is playing major triads in the Messaien, the cello itself keeps hanging on to suspensions, added notes, and minor thirds to the harmony, which constantly imply minor mode to the listener, if not modal ambiguity.

The ear WILL remember the melody more so than the harmony beneath it.

Just thought I'd point that out.

(not addressed to Niko)

Besides, come on, anyone has to admit that music that is ALL "major" has GOT to be boring at some point? Why else would secondary themes and development sections in classical-era music so often use modal shifts? (ie: relative minor, modal transposition of material, etc..)

Just to add to this, from a slightly "technical" or theoretical point of view:

In music that is predominantly major-mode, adding a single chromatic passing note that implies minor mode, will have a profound impact on the general modal feel of the music. This is part of the reason many people have difficulty distinguishing modal music from actual minor-mode music.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

All anything will get boring after a while.

Nick, I don't remember anyone in this thread saying that major is unequivocally happy, and minor sad - so why the wink smiley face?

Anyway, I don't get this negative view of being happy that many of you seem to have.

You don't have to try to be miserable - life will take care of that at some point..... which is where uplifting music helps.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest QcCowboy

Well, I for one, am not an advocate of the "major=happy" school of music... I'm listening to the Berg violin concerto as I write this, and the opening movement is unequivocally "happy" music. This is most definately neither major nor minor music.

And just to add an important detail to the "minor=sad" thing, the final movement of the Berg violin concerto has a quote from a Bach choral in it that is basically in a major key, yet it is absolutely the saddest moment in this work of already profound tragedy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think of major keys as being "happy". I think of them as being "sweet".

That said, I like both of them. Without major keys, minor keys will not sound the same way as no contrast exists.

Exactly: Major does not have to be happy and minor does not have to be sad. Examples: The Cavatina from Beethoven's Op 130 String Quartet in Bb is not a happy movement even though it is in Eb Major. Another example from the same piece: the Bb minor "Scherzo" second movement isn't really sad - it's a little mysterious and a little dance-like.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think, based on some earlier posts that a few definitions/basic theory concepts need to be gone over.

Someone mentioned using minor chords in a major mode may help their composition.

If we are composing in strict C major, the notes of the C major scale are used in the harmony, so: C D E F G A B C

This means that the root position triads are:

CEG-major

DFA-minor

EGB-minor

GBD-Major

BDF-diminished

To avoid some confusion in regards to modes:

ionian, lydian, mixolydian are all major modes. Major refers to the relationship of the root positiion tonic triad. Ex. C ionian, C lydian, C mixolydian all have a root position tonic triad of CEG which is a major chord.

dorian, aeolian, phrygian are all minor. Again, when based on C, all would have a root position tonic triad of C Eb G-minor triad.

locrian-a diminished mode-root position tonic triad is C Eb Gb

This same rule will apply to any scale/mode of the scale. Someone mentioned the octatonic scale...This scale, and other more obscure scales (or possibly non obscure scales) are not necessarily harmonized strictly by the same scale. An octatonic scale is an alteration of half and whole steps with either coming first depending on the mode. Let us examine the half step first variety from C: C C# D# E F# G# A B C As you can see this is an 8 tone scale. If we were to harmonize with the scale itself, major and minor tonality can be accomplished. since E and Eb(D#) are available as the 3rd...However the fifth would have to be altered or omitted if an augmented triad is to be avoided. However, one composing with this scale likely is not interested in a standard major/minor harmony.

Tertian/Quartal/Quintal harmony...This refers to chord construction..we are used to chords by thirds...CEG, GBDF, etc...quartal harmony is chords by fourths: CFBb, DGCF, etc, and quintal by fifths..

Ok, sorry if this has been a burden, but I hope this has helped someone. If anyone feels that my post has errors let me know :-)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest QcCowboy

actually, you make a minor (no pun intended) error on the octatonic scale,

it is an alternation of minor and major 2nds:

C - Db - Eb - E natural - F# - G natural - A natural (and not G#, A# as you have) - Bb (and not B natural) - and return to C.

what you have listed has the lower tetrachord of a C natural octatonic scale, and the upper tetrachord of a C# octatonic scale. Your scale is, in effect an octatonic scale (having eight notes to it), however, it is not one of Messaien's "modes

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm glad to see minor taking the cake, so far... major is for sissies. 8)

Naw, just joking. Both sides can really create a beautiful, sad or joyous work, as well as capturing the many emotions in between. I'm really partial to tunes in major that make a broad use of minor chords and explore how both scales can co-exist at the same time.

Deceptive cadence fan #1!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I used to prefer minor keys, but now I realize that I can use major to enhance a minor part and vice versa. I don't actually think in terms of major or minor anymore, they both mix naturally.

It's like talking about tall and short. If "tall" doesn't exist, would it make any sense to talk about "short"??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I prefer phrygian, but natural minor is close enough for this poll. Should have included the modes.

As .... umm... dh4m13l (whatever that means, no offense) said, they (major and minor) both mix naturally, and I used them together often, polychords and polyharmony. I'll play a minor harmonic structure under a more major tone series or motif, yet for some reason it doesn't work quite as well for me the other way around.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally written by Finrod

I just like the dark/mysterious side of things

The major key is more dark and mysterious when used properly, like Debussy knows how to in his La Mer. Most of anybody will say minor is very dark and mysterious, and that's not as true as saying major is very dark and mysterious.

Too much of this conversation I read tends to be too subtle for me, like child talk. Theory of the major and minor is not at all any of this "triad," and "key signature" and "technical" talk. If the pitch is right, you compose right. There is nothing apparent to discuss by this poll... Major vs Minor. I'm not going to throw in a whole bunch of random numbers and try to make it sound believable. All I am hearing so far is, oh this is cool, oh yea, and that is cool. Okay, agreed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I prefer phrygian, but natural minor is close enough for this poll. Should have included the modes.

As .... umm... dh4m13l (whatever that means, no offense) said, they (major and minor) both mix naturally, and I used them together often, polychords and polyharmony. I'll play a minor harmonic structure under a more major tone series or motif, yet for some reason it doesn't work quite as well for me the other way around.

Hi! dh4m13l is just "daniel" with a different look... d4n13l... see? polychords? polyharmony? where's my harmony book...? :sadtears: I still have a loooooooooooooong way to go... did you upload any examples? any compositions of yours showing this.. poly whatever thing? :toothygrin:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

lol.... well, not really, but I can show you to an exercise in the orchestration masterclass that has this stuff in it. This link should take you directly to post #110 where you can check it out: http://www.youngcomposers.com/forum/orchestration-part-1-discussion-10363-6.html#post180943

If it doesn't take you to post #110, just find it in that thread.

Notice how odd the chords are and how the theme in the winds interweaves though the harmonic texture of the chords. Credit goes to Qccowboy for this little phrase, was a beast to harmonize, and then I found out that we weren't supposed to harmonize it in the first place. :w00t:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...