What makes a piece great?

As an amateur composer I have made much progress in the past year in my music, but I still haven't reached a point where I consider my music to be "professional" or worth much value. So what I want to know is what criteria makes a piece professional that separates it from being mediocre and amateurish?

I've had a hard time trying to come to terms with myself on this. I just can't seem to find an explanation that relies on anything else but emotion. If I listen to a piece and it has a sound of emotion, where it feels like every note is valuable because it's part of the emotion that is portrayed, I consider it very good, but in many cases I will listen to something, also works that others consider fantastic, and say "nah I don't like it", 10-20 seconds after it has started. It's comparable to a flame. It needs to be ignited before it can burn. And like that, I often quickly know whether I'm gonna like a piece or not, depending on the length of it. On the other hand, this approach to music is a very limiting one, and everytime I think "this is not a good piece" after a few seconds, I have to stop myself from thinking that and be open-minded instead. And thankfully, a lot of pieces surprise me, and disprove the idea that can tell if a piece is good, from listening to the beginning of the piece.

So basically what I end up with when I think of this is: "Do I feel anything when I listen to it" And as simple as it seems, this is how far I am in how I approach music. Which also makes it hard to be a reviewer sometimes, since it's not the best approach to just say "I didn't like it, because I didn't feel anything when I heard it" xD

Without going into to much detail, I find that the separation often occurs in the subtle things. In my opinion, it's just a lot of the simple basic stuff done well and put together well that can make a piece great. I think that's what separates most amateurs from a professional (using these terms loosely.) When listening to an amateur's piece there tends to be a lot of small things that just don't jive, such as instrumental conflicts, playability, clarity of ideas, etc. As a personal progresses in their learning and gains more experience, those problems become less of an issue and eventually things start to click. I'm sure people who been writing for a few years understand what I'm talking about, so I'll leave it at that.

Well, it's pretty darn subjective to what people consider great. Technically, it is "great" if an overwhelming amount of people like it. Though someone who hates classical music could easily say a pop song is great and say...idk, Rachmaninoff piano concerto no.3 is terrible, which of course has many fans. Completely subjective. There are some things you can do that most of society will like. Personally, a piece is only as good as much as I like it. If I don't like it, it gets thrown into my digital recycling bin and I start over. If I do like it, I try to make it as good as possible and labor over it like crazy, but I don't post that stuff on YC. That's all I have to say.

Is this a trick question??

Just for some assholes. Look I know someone is gunna jump in here and say blah blah it's all subjective there's no objectiveness greatness blahb lah blah who gives a gently caress. Just tell people somethings you tend to see in music that's great to you.

The OP is asking two different questions. What can be perceived as "Professional" music is not necessarily the same as "great" music. I mean there's a lot of music I think is scraggy that I would still call professional.

yeah and that stops you from answering one of those questions...how?

Considering the other dozen threads with the exact same topic, it's not like I have to say anything. Or anyone, for that matter. I wonder if the search feature still works, lol.

It depends: do you use strings or not? I mean you gotta use strings, dude. No great piece omits strings. Always strings. Listen to all the bad music out there. Whats the problem? No strings!

good music:

Grieg: Aase's Death

James Newton-Howard: Macrotus

Celine Dion: I'm you'r Angel

bad music:

Miles Davis: Kind of Blue

Copland: Fanfare for the common man

anything with BB King....

see my point?

It depends: do you use strings or not? I mean you gotta use strings, dude. No great piece omits strings. Always strings. Listen to all the bad music out there. Whats the problem? No strings!

How about Holst's Band Suites? How about anything by the Beatles? How about vocal works by Renaissance composers? How about Copland's Fanfare for.... oh wait.

long live palestrina!

See Tokke, no need for such questions anymore! Just listen for strings :)......oh wait: and sarcasm too ;)

plus: The beatles use lots of strings. Both real and mellotron

Thanks everyone for your comments, especially the constructive ones. All I am asking is what makes music professional, what makes a composer mature?

to make your music professional, you need to approach music in a professional way, and there are many factors going in this equation, but as said-it won't make your music "great" necessarily, just very well produced.

i can think of many things, but i won't be able to put them all in, as there are so many-

questions needs to be asked after sketching your piece:

"is the idea passable?", "what needs to be balanced", " is it grooving/is it not grooving intentionally", "comparing to other pieces of the same theme, how would i rate, what needs to be improved", "is it boring?" , "is it interesting to listen?", "is it new, innovative at all?", "how do i feel when i listen to it?". after answering just a few of the questions, you can try and modify your piece to the direction you want it to sound better.

learn mixing, sound editing techniques, take out other composers creation which you worship and learn from them, what made their music so great.

for example, i'm taking out john williams's "time tunnel" theme, and putting it all on a computer digital libraries, just to see if i can hear all of his great ideas, how can i mix an orchestra and make it sound like the original.

also very important you'll need an audience, which is usually less subjective than you. listen to what they say and improve, so on and so on.

Okay all jokes aside - and you must admit, I'm pretty funny!

The difference between professional and amateurish lies not in the music, but in the person. Webster defines professional as 1) one making a living of it 2) educated in the field

I'm a professional organist. I don't have a degree and never took lessons, but I make living playing in a church.

To me professional also is about getting the job done and doing it on time with attention to every detail. If you have a great compositional idea, you have to rely on professional musicians to perform it and a professional technician to record it a.s.o.

I don't see how you can call any music bad.

I don't see how you can call any music bad.

Depends on what you call music!

But in answer to the question, my personal oppinion is:

Harmonys and chord progressions...

Also how original the peice is.

Just my oppinion

Derrick

Thanks everyone for your comments, especially the constructive ones. All I am asking is what makes music professional, what makes a composer mature?

First, I would leave the term professional on the door step. Any composer, whether good or bad, can be professional - no matter what you're experience is. Second, you become mature through experience. WE composers HAVE to compose lots and lots and lots of music before we even find that 'subjective' original voice. I've been writing for 15 years now... and still haven't found it. Granted, I've had a lot happen in my life that has limited the time I composed in the past. Now, I compose a good 12+ hours a day. Then for 2 - 3 hours I try to find performance/commission opportunities. It's not as easy as it may seem - especially to get your foot in the door (hence, why I said leave the term professional on the door step). My work shows signs of how long I been writing - largely in my brevity of ideas and overall structure to my works YET.. I won't say it's matured yet - and personally don't want it to be mature at this stage (none of us should).

I hope that helps.