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Posted (edited)

I've been preparing for this for a while with new string libraries and how to finesse them into something decent at this tempo, which is aggressive and dense. Also I've been listening to lots and lots of strings. Elgar, Schnittke, Barber, Bartok. But I kept coming back to Bach and Handel. Maybe for a Baroque aesthetic and form if nothing else. I am uncomfortable writing pure 18th century harmonies because frankly I don't know all the rules, and I'm not a purist, probably because of ego, etc. So you might hear some violation of those rules. Anyway, I'll follow up with a slow movement followed by another fast one. Sorry, no score, but I will post it in about a week, so please check back. Thanks!

This is for a string chamber orchestra with soloists: two violins, a viola and a cello.

Edited by Ken320
Premature. Needs a do-over.

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Looking forward to seeing the score, but this sounds good!  Was there anything in particular that prompted the project?  Chance to do some in depth string work?

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Posted (edited)

The score is a mess! But I am very interested in your opinions on what can be improved here. I have my doubts about it. 🤔

Edit: My apologies. The post was premature. I'm scrapping it and re-writing it in 6/8. Will re-record it along with some changes.

Edited by Ken320

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Posted (edited)

Here is the new music with score. It should be much clearer now. 😊

 

Edited by Ken320
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On 4/4/2019 at 11:38 AM, pateceramics said:

Looking forward to seeing the score, but this sounds good!  Was there anything in particular that prompted the project?  Chance to do some in depth string work?

 

There is one now, sorry it took a while.

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Interesting.  I like it.  might even love it.  I  think I want it to have the full orchestra and not just strings but I get why you did that.  I would love to hear this with all the different colors though.  Yeah, I might love this...

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On 4/20/2019 at 7:49 PM, maestrowick said:

Interesting.  I like it.  might even love it.  I  think I want it to have the full orchestra and not just strings but I get why you did that.  I would love to hear this with all the different colors though.  Yeah, I might love this...

 

Unfortunately their are no other colors to be had, unless you have some suggestions. And then they would have to be realized only in strings otherwise it's not a string piece. Haha! I have never seen a ruby and wished it was an emerald. But I will say that there are real limitations to sampled strings and I would give anything to have this played with period instruments. I played a Handel Concerto note for note with these instruments and viola! It didn't sound that good!

But if you want to offer some back seat driving (I do it all the time) I would be happy to hear it.

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Hey, nice piece!

I'm very happy when i see the old therms like a concerto grosso. As you might know, i am a purist, but i really don't mind combining styles etc. But what I do expect is that the therm follows some of its traditional traits as a base. Like you would expect a fish to resemble a fish, swim and live in the water. Could be a flying fish though , but still it have to resemble a fish to have fish in the name i think.

I had difficulties to find the concerto grosso structure here. I can see you have some sort of Concertino and ripieno, but the entire point of a concerto grosso is the contrasts and unity between the two groups, its actually like Piano/forte effect. A concerto grosso is a great tool for orchestration without using a orchestra.

I can see form you score that you dont have imitation in mind. Your initial idea is perfect for a concerto grosso. To make the contrast it could have been like this:

Bar 2 - 3 in the ripieno

Bar 4 -5 in concertino

Same material, but different sound and color because of the groups, typical concerto grosso. The same goes for structure. Concerto Grosso is all about the contrast. development at unity between the groups. Use the groups, Luke, the groups!

May the force of corelli and stradella be with you.

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

I think you're right. I should have formalized the interplay more between the two, but that's when I get into trouble. I'm kind of stumbling around in the dark here trying to bridge the past and present, or find the commonality that other composers seem to manage quite easily. Or just do something that will interest people. It's very frustrating. Maybe this is just a working experiment? Thanks for your comments!

Edited by Ken320

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I agree with Simen-N.  More contrast between what material is given to the soloists, and what is given to the rest of the players would help.  As it is, the quartet's lines may get lost under the heavier texture of the other strings, because often both are playing at the same time, and there isn't too much difference in the rhythms or ranges of the material they present at that time.  It can be a case of making some decisions to assign what you already have here differently.  The first section has a long intro by just the larger group.  That could be reorganized as call and response from one set of players to the other.  Later when both groups are in simultaneously, giving the larger orchestra simpler material and the quartet more of the moving lines that feel more virtuosic would help them stand out.  You could also put the larger group on pizz. for a while, and give your soloists some nice legato that would stand out in contrast.  

Your skipping rhythm at the beginning could be written using staccatos instead of alternating eighth notes and eighth rests for a cleaner score, but I know you said you wanted to clean up the score.  It all sounds nice, so just reassigning who is playing what in some places may tighten it up a lot.  Thumbs up!

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*** Your skipping rhythm at the beginning could be written using staccatos instead of alternating eighth notes and eighth rests for a cleaner score, but I know you said you wanted to clean up the score.  It all sounds nice, so just reassigning who is playing what in some places may tighten it up a lot.  Thumbs up!

That rhythm was originally in 16th notes, and while it was "snappier" it was inconsistent with the rest of the piece. And I thought that people would  see them mixed together and wonder what was I thinking, or maybe I am putting too fine a point on it (which I was). So changing over to 12/8,/9/8 and 6/8 eliminated the inconsistencies and simplified things. But as to the beaming, that I like and will keep. It's very clear! And at the tempo they are pretty much staccato. You'll notice in general the score is not overly marked up.

I appreciate your suggestions and I'm going to them a lot of thought. But I think I'll move on to the slow movement for now and get a little distance from the struggles of the first one, to which I will return! Thanks!

 

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