Stuck on the Gloria...

I'm writing a Mass, with full orchestra, choir, and four soloist. It's going to be a semi-theater influenced piece, with music and original lyrics reflecting each soloist's character and their relation with God and the church. It will be following the standard Episcopalian Mass. I have four movements so far: 1. Alleluia(opening call-and-answer-Any soloist and choir), 2. The Word of God(the beginning of every Mass service-Tenor solo and choir), 3. Kyrie(tenor solo and choir), and 4. Gloria(all soloists and choir).

I'm up to Domine Fili Unigenite in the Gloria, and I'm stuck. I want to keep the idea of the baritone being the bad guy, but introduce soloists from within the choir, and having the baritone kind of yell at each of them, in an abstact way. I just got out of this wacky upbeat part and I'm not sure where to go from here on. Any ideas?

P.S. The MIDI has a lot of screwed-up sounds, like pizz. strings where I want arco, etc. Get Sibelius Scorch if you can, to view the Sib file.

I am not a religious man and don't know much about the Liturgical texts, so I can't comment on the mood. I can say that this sounds very much like pop music, and the transition that occurs at ~ 2:04 was not to my liking. Then at ~ 3:00 it starts to sound like cartoon music. I also did not like the drum beat that gave the piece an enormous pop feel.

I would presume that a proper mass shouldn't sound like pop music, but what do I know. The only full mass I have heard is Beethoven's Missa Solemnis.

Overall, and this is coming from a church-outsider, I think that when writing a mass it should not have a "pop" feel, which at times in your piece gives it a cartoon-like humor that isn't usually associated with sacred music. But if you were going for a "pop" feel, than I congratulate you on your fine piece.

Whenever the congregation sings the standard liturgical texts, I will write the music more pop-ish, more simple, most suitable for a mass(no pun intended) audience.

This is a Mass in the sense of praising God and whatnot, it's just a contemporary one. Unlike Bach's and Mozart's Masses, and all the other popular ones, I'm not taking the text as literal. I'm working a lot with irony, hence the upbeat feeling of my Kyrie. As for the Gloria, I gave it a laid back feeling rather than joyous and celebratory, because usually most people in a congregation are rather conservative about showing that kind of open belief and faith. So I toned it down a bit.

I'm not religious, and I don't believe in God. Hell, Bernstein was Jewish and his Mass was quite a powerful work!! Some of it was outright blasphemous! I'm not taking it quite that far, with dancing or costumes or lighting or 2 full orchestras, but I do have theater elements.

A 'proper' mass? It's my music, dude! :P You mustn't take the texts so literal! I'm taking spins on some elements and overdramaticizing other elements, etc.

...and you offered no help to me on how to finish the Gloria! :D

P.S. Thank you for calling it a 'fine piece'.

Nick,

The piece is good, don't take my first post as an insalt. I have nothing but admiration for everyone on this forum, and I say it again, the music is just amazing that everyone is posting.

The reason I didn't comment on the ending is...

1. I found that my other comments were more what was passing through my head, and perhaps if addressed, they could have affected your writing process and in turn caused you to find an ending.

2. I believe that music is a personal thing, and that any ending you make for this should come from your own creativity. Therefore what I can say is that if you are blocked (and I'm blocked on a project myself so this advise is what I follow myself), set the piece aside for a couple days, maybe even a week, but listen to what you have everyday once or twice. Eventually, up of the blue almost, the idea you were looking for will just jump into your head!

I know that I had been writing a number of different ideas down for Scene 11 of my opera, but nothing was "doing it" for me. I eventually just set it aside and worked on other projects. But then one night, out of nowhere, I was laying in bed and there it was... the idea I needed. I'm now well on my way to completing the piece!

Anyway, sorry if this isn't helpful, but I think that if you give it a little time, you'll get the ending that this piece needs, and best of all, it will be an ending that matches the start because it came from you and you alone. :P

Hmm...methinks "Gratias agimus tibi" is a bit too blatantly lifted from the Gloria of the Bernstein Mass. :P

Half the people are drowned, and the the other half are swimming in the wrong direction...

Interestingly, I just sang a contemporary (but unironic) Gloria in choir, and the section you're about to reach in your work was set to an almost absurdly lyrical lullaby-like melody. Perhaps you can have the soprano soloist do something along those lines, and have the baritone do...I dunno, whatever she isn't doing.

Man, now I want to do a mass. Dang you for inspiring me!

Maybe you ought to learn what the Mass is about, first, then. There is no reason for the Kyrie to be anything less than upbeat. The assumption is that MERCY will be granted by God and Christ. The Episcopal Mass is the same as a Catholic or Lutheran Mass, by the way.

Irony? That is SOO last-century! Actually, I wonder what there is to be ironic about, and why bother? I wouldn't suppose it will get any liturgical performance, but it might be fun for a concert.