Modern Piano Piece - Opinions?

Guys,

This is my first composition that I'm posting for you guys. I started it about a month ago and after getting it written down I'm going to see if I somehow twist it into an orchestra/piano piece.

Note the arpeggio motif... it shouldn't be too hard to pick up on. :unsure:

Tell me what you think as I could certainly use suggestions! By the way, this is an actual recording on a real piano. The "orchestra" in the background is LESS than perfect because it's simply me playing a "slow orchestra" part on my keyboard. Pardon any clashing between the two parts, because recording the orchestra part was a real pain, lol.

This is a work in progress, mind you. I don't even have an orchestra part "written" yet.

Chris

P.S... I just came to the realization that everyone of you is going to say that it is too repetitive. I'm working on that. Also, the original recording lacks the dynamics that I wanted it to have, but hey, that's life. :P

Well Chris, this is a very effective piece of music. This struck me right away as highly intuitive (I found out I was right later). It has a dreamy, atmospheric quality. The straightforward melodies, harmonic progressions, patterns, even the loose, rudimentary form

Lee,

Thank you very much for your response. After reading what you wrote, I can tell that music truly can speak. Much of what you inferred regarding how I approach music is indeed true.

After reading your questions, I figured that I'd answer them one by one as they are all valid.

What are you hoping to accomplish in music?

Honestly, my 'dream job' would be to commercially compose, as you mentioned, for motion pictures. You can take a mood or theme you want to convey and expand and expand on it. Right now in my life, I'm confused as to whether to pursue a musical career or to go into aviation, my other "dream." I'd love them both. Alright, onto number two, which will help to explain my past and present frusteration in learning to read.

Is there some reason why you have chosen not to take any musical education, or were you not able to take any?

I have been taking piano lessons from the age of seven. That's eight completed years of study. I've done all the scales and arpeggios at 72 in 16ths, and I've gone through my share of music books. And yet, I struggle to this day with reading.

Earlier this year, I told my instructor that I felt as if I was trying to read two separate lines of English writing at the same time (in reference to the grand staff). And, that is exactly how I feel. When given a piece, I have to figure out measure by measure, and then I just memorize it after playing it once. My ear may in fact be what is keeping me from advancing in my ability to read. Either way, I'm continuing with my education and I hope something will "click" in my mind that opens my eyes to music, not just my ears.

Is

I have been taking piano lessons from the age of seven. That's eight completed years of study. I've done all the scales and arpeggios at 72 in 16ths, and I've gone through my share of music books. And yet, I struggle to this day with reading.

Earlier this year, I told my instructor that I felt as if I was trying to read two separate lines of English writing at the same time (in reference to the grand staff). And, that is exactly how I feel. When given a piece, I have to figure out measure by measure, and then I just memorize it after playing it once. My ear may in fact be what is keeping me from advancing in my ability to read. Either way, I'm continuing with my education and I hope something will "click" in my mind that opens my eyes to music, not just my ears.

Wow... it's just that that reminds me of me so much. I've completed eight (or maybe nine?) years of piano with a teacher. However, I could never read music: I would always have to take the piece home and memorize it measure by measure. Then, as I started to do longer pieces I couldn't (and wouldn't take the time to) memorize the whole thing. And it's only been my latest teacher (last year and this year) who gave me a piece and then later heard me play through it perfectly 'til a certain point when I had to start 'reading'... and then I couldn't play any more at all basically. She said, "You can't read music, can you!?!". My earlier teachers were, I guess, too neglectful to even notice. But, this teacher quickly got me doing sight reading book after sight reading book. As well as a bunch of studies (using patterns and easy enough stuff to just play the first time you see it, kind of thing, so I get better at recognizing notes).

My particular way to 'read music' before was that I would always get Middle C on the music (one leger line below treble) and then count the spaces up to the first note of the piece. Start there, and start reading the steps... like adjacent, one step in between, two steps in between, on the melody. Then, I would start memorizing. It sounds so ridiculous now... ... However, I think it may have improved my ability at understanding patterns and things like that, though... so it may have had some kind of benefit. (Plus my ear training is very good and people always said I have a good ear... so that is likely related)

Now, I'm a poor sight reader... but I can read music. Just as you spend more and more time playing and reading off music, you can recognize notes faster. Even at the start of this year I'd have trouble whenever the right hand melody would go over A two octaves above middle C on the music. But that's much better now and I continue to improve.

Similarly: in my violin I've only just started to understand the names of notes on the staff rather than just which string and finger number they correspond to maybe last year. (It's especially important on the violin when dealing with different key signatures to understand the note names! I used to always miss the sharps and such 'cause I only recognized the finger and not the note)

Being able to read music is nice, but there is one drawback for me... this year I couldn't memorize much of my music! I was so reliant on memorization before that now something's changed and since the sheet music has some use to me, I have trouble memorizing!! So, I'll have to figure that out still... ...

(Btw... I haven't actually listened to your song yet, so it's ridiculous that I even wrote this.... but I will listen to your song and then comment on it!!!! :P )

xyc,

Ah, I was wondering if anyone on these forums was ever in the same boat I'm in. I still find myself using "relativity" to decipher music that isn't able to be learned by ear for one reason or another.

Oddly enough, I can read cello pieces very well. However, I do not do it by the "names" of the notes. I simply see the note and know where my fingers go. Thus, being able to play cello doesn't quite help my reading either.

Considering that we've both had similiar experiences, I'm curious as to what you think of my above piece and if it is similiar to something an ear-player such as your previous-self would compose.

Thanks again,

Chris

Ah, I was wondering if anyone on these forums was ever in the same boat I'm in. I still find myself using "relativity" to decipher music that isn't able to be learned by ear for one reason or another.

I've been playing guitar for roughly 8 years and still can't sight read... in all honesty, I never made a concertrated effort at it as composition has always been my passion, not performance, but I am in that same boat too... True, it is only one staff for guitar, but it might as well be two, as there are basically two lines going on at all times... they just put them on the same staff.

Originally posted by J. Lee Graham@Jul 26 2005, 04:01 AM

In this light especially, the repetition of patterns in the piece didn

Cavatina,

Thanks for your remarks, I highly appreciate them.

The transition at 1:20... yes, that was VERY rough. My friend was trying to adjust the mic and cut the sound for about half a second.

I'm off to Ireland in two days and I hope to play piano a lot there while I'm there. After more than a few days with the piano I start to go crazy. Wait, do they HAVE piano's in Ireland?!? :P

Chris

This is a pretty nice piece - definitely has a Philip Glass feel with the constant arpeggiation accompaniment (not in a bad way, though). The harmonies feel more contemporary than modern (or Modern, anyways - which tends to be associate with a more avant garde quality), drawing more heavily from "popular" music than "classical", in my opinion anyways. I do have to say that it starts to get repetitive near the end (ie, if you go for another 5 minutes in the same style, I'd probably get bored of it), so maybe for you next sections you could add a bit more contrast (rhythmically, harmonically, however you want). Anyways, I hope you end up finishing this piece - keep up the good work!

WOW. Amazing! This piece you evidently just played out is better than a lot of written compositions I've heard lately! Let's hear it for just good ol' feelin' the music. Of course, improvisation can only go so long in one vein, usually, before it does indeed begin to seem repetitive. This piece falls into that rut, but is very beautiful nonetheless, and I was entranced.

Thank you for composing something that doesn't sound like noise pollution that most people create. thank you thank you, *applause*

Wow. The part that starts at 3:43 or so is genuinely awesome. Overall, I do like this composition very much. But let me pick at it a bit. Being not as technical in the process of composition than say I or some other composers on the forums, you tend to go for the more basic and common progressions. This isn't always bad, but it has been done before. A song like this can be very trite very quickly. What I like about it is the modest sound it has, being just piano and synth strings in the background. It creates a very personal feeling, which DEFINITELY overweighs any of the technical problems. You've got a nice piece here. It's not very intellectually-stimulating, which is what usually does it for me, but it's a great start.

Originally posted by C. Ryan+Jul 27 2005, 10:16 PM-->

Earlier this year, I told my instructor that I felt as if I was trying to read two separate lines of English writing at the same time (in reference to the grand staff). And, that is exactly how I feel.

Pardon me if I laugh. *laughs* Try playing the organ!! Ok I'm done. :)

Thank you for composing something that doesn't sound like noise pollution that most people create. thank you thank you,

Oh please. You call it noise pollution, I call it Bartok. :P

Ya same thing :blush: :lol:

I'm listening to this piece at present. You've captured the feeling of floating through the air very well. There is not much in the way of formal development. It's mostly just a continuous variation on the opening theme. The variations are all peaceful and interesting however. There is a James Newton Howrad quality to the arpeggio portions though.

Overall, it is pleasant to listen to, no question there. As we are nearing the end, I can tell that you are trying to add a bit more drama to the harmonic progressions. You are clearly a skilled pianist. Was this an improvisation or was it writtne out before hand?

Hi, this really is quite a beautiful and enigmatic piece, the opening bars are just perfect! the arpeggiated theme at around the 30 sec mark likewise.

The nice touches also include (for me!) the chord change slightly after 1 min, the chord movement at 3min30 and the major/minor at 4min40.

The only parts which in my humble opinion may let the piece down (minimally) are 1) the change at 3min20 and

2) the ending does seem quite right.

But, who am i to say?!!

This really is a startling piece, which you should be proud of, i like the way it leads you one way and then changes direction, and still holds its own. The upset for me is that you don't get to hear the amazing opening theme again, which i suppose can only be a good thing as you then want to listen to it again!

thank you. :o

Wow. This is excellent. When I was reading through this thread I saw many parallels between you and I. I too struggle enormously with reading. It is so frustrating because I have all the stuff about notation down, I can write my own songs and I can understand a written peice of music, however I cannot sight read very well at all. It is a huge roadblock in my way to a musical career. I am starting college in two weeks for a degree in composition and also high school music education and I am afraid my poor sight reading skills will hold me back. I understand what you mean when you said your ear for music holds you back. I think mine does too. I can relate to a lot of what you said. I think your music is awesome!!!!!!!

Oh. wow.

that was really amazing. I must agree that is very movie-music like.

I just thought I'd let you know that I was feeling a little down in the dump and frustrated before I listened to your piece, but now I really do feel inspired (actually I'm a tad bit discouraged too because it sounds like you have a lot of natural talent). I've always loved movie music, and this was really good even without the visual complement.

I've always aimed to make a piece much like yours.

Congratulations.

Originally posted by C. Ryan@Jul 25 2005, 09:36 PM

Guys,

This is my first composition that I'm posting for you guys. I started it about a month ago and after getting it written down I'm going to see if I somehow twist it into an orchestra/piano piece.

Note the arpeggio motif... it shouldn't be too hard to pick up on. :lol:

Tell me what you think as I could certainly use suggestions! By the way, this is an actual recording on a real piano. The "orchestra" in the background is LESS than perfect because it's simply me playing a "slow orchestra" part on my keyboard. Pardon any clashing between the two parts, because recording the orchestra part was a real pain, lol.

This is a work in progress, mind you. I don't even have an orchestra part "written" yet.

Chris

P.S... I just came to the realization that everyone of you is going to say that it is too repetitive. I'm working on that. Also, the original recording lacks the dynamics that I wanted it to have, but hey, that's life. :P

I like the "echoey" opening figures. I am reminded of George Winston, only your music has more energy to it. (as does soupinmyhair's composition) Anyway this is an attractive piece. My suggestion, which is based on my own taste, is to add more stray notes and key changes to your music. That's just my opinion though.

Wow, excellent piece. It reminds me a bit of James Horner's work in A Beautiful Mind.

Excuse the very short post, but I've just listened to it 3 straight times and wanted to quickly post how much I'm enjoying it. :)

Oh, and definitely go for it (composing film scores). I obviously don't know if you'd be able to consistently turn out pieces like this, but c'mon, you're only 15, and you seem to be far along already. I look forward to hearing your future work.

Guys,

Thanks for your constructive comments and such; I've just finished getting the piece down in Finale and it's a measure past 15 pages.

Just to clear things up, this is not improv. I "wrote" this whole piece in my mind therefore everytime I play it, it's exactly the same. After reading your opinions, I've altered the "so-so" sections.

At from 3:10 to 3:17, I now have a MASSIVE crescendo that suddenly drops to piano as the new theme comes in at 3:17. Also, from 3:17 to 3:42, the tempo is quicker despite the quite nature of the section.

Nick(toven),

I actually came up with that climactic section (3:43) first and then decided to create a whole piece around it. You'll notice that the beginning of the piece is, well, "up in the air." Exactly how it should be. Then, it slowly resolves in to the main arpeggiated theme which finally gets somewhere at 3:43. The point of this piece is to represent some sort of "unpredictable revelation."

Derek, thanks. The echoey figures are a toughie... it's all about timing on the pedals (sustain and damper) as well as the hand "rolling" in the upper sextuplets.

Drakken, I guess I have been influenced in some ways... "Kaleidoscope of Mathematics" is excellent.

Chris