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FINALE GUIDE TO MORE ADVANCED TECHNIQUES

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Impresario, certain elements are only available in the full version of Finale. It could be that what you're looking for may also be in a different area. Checking the help section can help you determine whether you can do this or not.

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I have the full version of Finale 2008. I know I could spend an eternity in the help files finding how to do what I want to do, but if someone who has done this before could help me save some time and might enjoy explaining how to do it, that's cool by me.

http://www.youngcomposers.com/forum/eternal-21858.html#post318516

The score I'm working on is in this post. I might be getting a reading and want to make some final edits. I'm trying to make my violin staves into grand staves (like a piano) to use to reinforce some of the harp material around pages 10-12. Obviously, if I reproduce the harp line in the same staff, I may encounter more difficulty in editing to keep notes from covering each other up, not to mention how much more difficult it would make for the performer reading the part. I would prefer to just have the violin parts both divide into grand staves (keeping both in treble clef, of course).

Can it be done in the score? Can it be done 'mid-score' or even 'mid-page'? What about the parts, will I be able to get this to transfer over when I extract the parts without facing major editing problems? It seems silly to dedicate a whole other staff/part to just reinforcing about 9-11 measures of material. Hope you guys can help, and thanks in advance!

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Can it be done in the score? Can it be done 'mid-score' or even 'mid-page'? What about the parts, will I be able to get this to transfer over when I extract the parts without facing major editing problems? It seems silly to dedicate a whole other staff/part to just reinforcing about 9-11 measures of material. Hope you guys can help, and thanks in advance!

I don't find it silly to use a new staff for just a couple of measures and that's exactly what I'd do. Give each violin part (1, 2, 3, 4) an individual staff, group them together to create a brace if you like and simply only use the additional staves whenever you want to split the parts into a grand staff. Then optimise your systems so the additional staff won't show on pages where you don't use it. Any other approach (such as using ossia staves etc.) would be way more messy in my opinion.

I've done the same thing lots of times. Some of my scores have individual "solo" staves for every single string section for example that are mostly invisible but are only used when there's a solo part alongside a tutti of the same section. This too may only last for a couple of measures, but who cares?

(This will only be "mid-score" and not "mid-system" of course, meaning that it will still show the additional staff with rests for a whole system if there are some notes anywhere on there. If you don't want that you can easily turn such unwanted measures invisible with staff styles.)

The main problem with this approach may be that if you have four staves called "Violin 1" to "Violin 4", having some of them hidden may show only two staves called "Violin 1" and "Violin 3" instead of "Violin 1, 2" and "Violin 3, 4". But the easy solution for this is not to use instrument names for the individual staves altogether, but to just use group names for the Violin 1, 2 grand staff and another for the Violin 3, 4 grand staff.

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It's really odd how this all came about. I think of this as 'a hindsight edit', meaning I had all my instrumentation mapped out, so to speak, I just didn't account for the idea I'd use more than four violin 'sections'. I actually need six sections for about 9-12 measures right near the end. So, I'm sort of stuck. I'm hoping there's a way Finale will create a mid system staff (preferably above the existing staff) to create space for additional music. I'm even planning on using smaller font for this like we'd use for creating queues for other parts so the systems in the parts aren't tremendously stretched out like the score is...

Ugh... seems like it would be a really easy thing to correct in the score layout, except that it isn't.

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Hmm, seems like I don't quite understand the problem yet. You can simply use the staff tool, select a staff and click on New Staves in the tool menu which will automatically create a new staff for you right above the selected one. Then it's simply a matter of grouping it with the existing staves in whatever way you prefer and optimising the systems in the end. And if you want a staff to be smaller, the resize tool is an easy way to do that.

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I added staves as you suggested and performed the edit as you said you would. Works fine for this work. I'd rather, somehow, have a way to make the staff end at a particular barline mid-page in the score though. If I come across this again, it would also be nice to be able to start a staff mid-page in the score as well, especially when I get a short duration idea and want to add it into the mix without having to completely re-edit my score.

But the job is done. I'll post the revision in the Eternal thread later. Thanks for the help!

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I'd rather, somehow, have a way to make the staff end at a particular barline mid-page in the score though.

Have you tried my advice about using staff styles for this? Use the staff tool, select the measures where you don't want the staff to be seen, right-click, then select "12. Hide Staff" (or similar - I only have the German version). (Or, if you still want certain elements to be shown, such as clefs etc., define your own staff style.)

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Have you tried my advice about using staff styles for this? Use the staff tool, select the measures where you don't want the staff to be seen, right-click, then select "12. Hide Staff" (or similar - I only have the German version). (Or, if you still want certain elements to be shown, such as clefs etc., define your own staff style.)

OH! DING DING! Totally makes sense now, thanks! :)

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However,

I am personally very dissatisfied with that kind of notation, because it seems a bit absurd - I don't like the symbol of quarter-tone sharp and quarter-tone flat, mainly because they ask you to think upwards and then downwards (quarter-tone sharp is a sharp with a downwards arrow, which makes you think "oh, I go up half a step, and then I lower that by a quarter of the tone), which is too complicated when you don't have much time for the players to get used to the notation.

About microtonal notation in general, there is this really good book by Gardner Read, called "20th-Century Microtonal Notation" which discusses microtonal notation from the medieval days to the hundreds of different notations composers have come up with to solve problems of microtonal notation, and discusses the effectiveness of each symbol or group of symbols and gives you a good ground on how to think more carefully when writing microtonally.

So the way I prefer to notate quarter-tones is by replacing the quarter-tone sharp symbol (sharp with a downwards arrow) with a natural sign and an upwards arrow (which indicates that you have to play that pitch, slightly raised and makes much more sense than the sharp with the downwards arrow), and a natural with a downwards arrow for quarter-tone flat.

Thankfully, both of these symbols exist in the Maestro Percussion font (and you can find them and all the other symbols in the font by simply using the Character Map tool in Windows -if you're using Windows- which is located in Start -> System Tools -> Character Map - Or WinKey+R, "charmap").

I'm with you on not using the sharp with a down arrow to represent a quarter tone sharp. Instead of using the natural sign with an up arrow I prefer to use the sharp symbol, but with one missing vertical line.

Any idea how to do this and get proper spacing in Finale?

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I don't see what problems this causes for spacing. Just use the method jujimufu suggested, but simply find a font that has these symbols. Engraver Font Extras does, I think, as does Maestro Percussion.

Alternatively, you can simply go to the Document options, then to "Accidentals", where you can change all kinds of accidentals (normals, doubles, the ones in brackets) to be displayed as any symbol you desire. If your piece never uses any double-sharps, for instance, you could simply replace the double-sharp sign with a quarter-sharp sign and then always write a "double-sharp" (which will then display as a quarter-sharp) when you need that. Or, if you never need accidentals in brackets, replace the "sharp in brackets" sign with a quarter-sharp sign and proceed in the same way (I like to do that - it has the benefit of being able to write sharps and flats with the same keyboard commands as always, and just requires pressing an extra key afterwards).

If you don't like the spacing of an accidental, you can always move it around afterwards.

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Alternatively, you can simply go to the Document options, then to "Accidentals", where you can change all kinds of accidentals (normals, doubles, the ones in brackets) to be displayed as any symbol you desire. If your piece never uses any double-sharps, for instance, you could simply replace the double-sharp sign with a quarter-sharp sign and then always write a "double-sharp" (which will then display as a quarter-sharp) when you need that. Or, if you never need accidentals in brackets, replace the "sharp in brackets" sign with a quarter-sharp sign and proceed in the same way (I like to do that - it has the benefit of being able to write sharps and flats with the same keyboard commands as always, and just requires pressing an extra key afterwards).

Sorry, I didn't realize that the quarter tone sharp I was looking for was in the Maestro Percussion font. I like the idea above, but I can't seem to change from the Maestro font to Maestro Percussion.

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I'm still not having luck with the quarter tone sharp in Finale. I want to use the quarter tone sharp that looks like a regular sharp but with one vertical line missing. This symbol is in the Maestro Percussion font but I don't know how to select it in the Special Key Signature Attributes. I know you click on Symbol List ID and choose an Alter value and a Characters value, but how do you know what Characters value to give? I can't find a complete list anywhere in the Finale manual and I've tried inputting all values I can think of (A-Z, a-z, and 0-9), but the quarter tone sharp I want is nowhere to be found.

[Edit] I have a laptop so I'm also lacking the number pad. What you can do is go into the character map (at least in Windows), copy the quarter tone sharp symbol from the Maestro Percussion font, and paste it into the Characters spot.

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Those are Tartini quarter-tone accidentals you're talking about! I love them. I think that character might be an alt-key character on the font mapping, but in order to obtain it you'd probably have to use a utility that would allow you to view each character of a font and what it's equivalent character would be. I found this utility (which has a free trial download); try that.

A less time-consuming method would be to download a microtone font containing the Tartini accidentals and input them into the Special Key Signature Attributes dialog box, I suppose, but the only problem would be that for that measure in which you want to use microtones (if you're only doing a segment) the font may not match the rest of the accidentals in the document.

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Sorry to resurrect a dead topic, but would anyone here have knowledge in writing nested tuplets in Finale?

One way would be to enter what you want with the Speedy Entry Tool then go back and use the Tuplet Tool. It doesn't matter whether you do the outside tuplet first or the inside one(s) when you use the Tuplet Tool. You might also apply the inner tuplet(s) when using the Speedy Entry Tool by using ctrl + some number (2-8) before entering notes to specify the tuplet you're working with at the time. Ctrl+1 brings up the Tuplet Definition dialog, which you have to use for 9-tuplets and higher. All of this works in Finale 2009, at least.

Thanks for the Tartini quarter-tone accidental advice, by the way.

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I would like to express my gratitude for this great job you made. I copied and paste it into a word file in order to read with calm and to practice.

Because I'm italian, i doulw like to write little mispelling I've seen with italian language:

It is "Accelerando" and "Rallentando" not "Acceleranto" and not "Rallentanto". Just the penultimate letter.

Thank you really very much for your effort

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