Op. 4, Symphony in C Minor

Nichtoven:

Have you listened to it? If so, what is your opinion?

Well, I was expecting something more towards my 'field' of music. I'm not sure why, but I pegged you as more of a moderist than your Symphony tells about you. But even though I usually abstain from commenting on works such as this, inspired from more romantic and classical eras, I'll comment on this piece.

There is a lot of softLOUDsoftLOUD going on here. The percussion helps this quite a bit. I'm not so sure the stops and starts are really adding much to the piece as a whole. The first movement sounds like it is in many different parts, like there are many endings. The themes are very nice and I cannot really find any faults in harmony and counterpoint, both of which you seem to have a knack for. But it sounds like I've heard it before. The orchestration isn't quite as varied as it could be, I suppose.

It does sound like it took quite a lot of work to churn out, and I respect that you were able to construct a piece like this. But the only issue I'd really stress if I were to rework this is flow. Like how the piece builds.

I hope this helps in any way possible.

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Hey! where are you guys? You give me grief on not posting a score (MIDI) file!

Hello?

CaltechViolist Nov 13 2005, 02:29 AM Post #2

Group: Global Moderators

Posts: 424

Joined: 26-May 05

From: Pasadena, CA

Additional rule: A SCORE IS REQUIRED.

If you have a MP3, feel free to post it, but also post either a MIDI file or a PDF score. Some of us prefer to have the music in front of them when listening, and it helps ensure a detailed, constructive review.

Hello. Well, I have downloaded the first two movements. Not what I expected. Your talent with themes and melodies is obvious and very well done. I look forward to hearing more from you. But, from the way you use your instruments and how you orchestrate I could guess you were a piano player. This is in no way a criticism... just something I observed. B/C of the type of music I compose my ear wanted to hear more complex counterpoint and play with harmonies to keep interest. I know that this is your oldest piece so I congratulate you on a job well done. Please post more.

Michael

PS Feel lucky that no one has mentioned that one of the rules for this forum (Major Works) is that you MUST show a score (MIDI) with your works. Would you feel comfortable with that? I'm glad to see people posting MP3's from sound libraries. To do that alone is art. Your recording is very realistic. Again, good job. By the way, please feel free to critique my compositions on either this site or my own at www.miserymadebeautiful.com. I too use sound libraries and the Gigastudio. Would really like to hear what you have to say. Thanks.

PS Feel lucky that no one has mentioned that one of the rules for this forum (Major Works) is that you MUST show a score (MIDI) with your works. Would you feel comfortable with that? I'm glad to see people posting MP3's from sound libraries. To do that alone is art. Your recording is very realistic. Again, good job. By the way, please feel free to critique my compositions on either this site or my own at www.miserymadebeautiful.com. I too use sound libraries and the Gigastudio. Would really like to hear what you have to say. Thanks.

If it must be that way, then I would prefer it if this was moved to another forum. I don't feel safe posting scores, sorry.

Thanks for the feedback.

Best,

John Carey

Hello. Well, I have downloaded the first two movements. Not what I expected.[/b]

And, just out curiosity, what was it exactly that you were expecting?

More twists and turns and ups and downs and variations; to blur the piece with ambiguity. But please understand, this is just my taste and my opinion. I can hear your talent and I absolutely respect it... and your judgement call on not showing scores. Protected talent... Why did I expect it? Not sure, maybe from what I was reading in here.

Respectfully,

Michael

More twists and turns and ups and downs and variations; to blur the piece with ambiguity. But please understand, this is just my taste and my opinion. I can hear your talent and I absolutely respect it... and your judgement call on not showing scores. Protected talent... Why did I expect it? Not sure, maybe from what I was reading in here.

Respectfully,

Michael

Thank you for your kind comments and for understanding the issue with scores. However, I do plan, hopefully in the near future, to publish the scores to some of my piano music on my website. Perhaps even on amazon.com if I can pay for it.

Best,

John Carey

I finally made time for this tonight, and I

Hi, I completely agree with J. Lee Graham. I too started off purely on instinct and natural talent; then years later I attended school for theory and such and it opened doors that I can't even explain. To have both, raw God given talent and knowledge in your arsenal is a huge accomplishment and a lethal musical combination.

I also wanted to ask you by what you meant by: "publishing your music on your website"? How is that done? And how do you get your music published on Amazon.com?

Thanks...

Michael

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Hey. Have been listening through your symphony (am actually writing my first at the moment).

Very, very briefly now! The first movement I liked with the opening idea before launching into a new section. Didn't hear exactly where the developement of the opening idea went though liked the maetoso gathering just before 3 mins. Your handling of instruments seems good though I'd need to get hold of a score before I say anything!! :) The second movement I have to agree was something. It was really nice. I wasn't sure about the third movement - it didn't seem to go anywhere though I did pick up the polyphonic lines and the weaving of those melodies. I wouldn't have chosen Allegro con brio for the tempo because it certainly wasn't what I had in mind! The fourth movement is good bringing back the original theme from the first with development. Shame about it's length though.

Sorry also for my short review. Overall (I just read now that you wrote this a while back), I think it just needs to be tied down and worked upon. There are some sections that don't need to be touched whereas others, well, I'm sure you know what I'm going to say and I'll leave it up to you as you're the composer! :thumbsup: Was slightly concerned about overall length but just checked now and it's clocking in at 25mins so I don't see any probs there.

Must get back to my symphony now ... stuck on this bloody third movement!!!!

Wow....I really love your work on this piece, very very nice. I am just a beginner....I hope to be able to compose like you someday!!!! Outstanding work, I am very impressed.

- Jen

I, for one, consider Mahler to be one of the greatest (if not the greatest, by my standards at least) symphonists who ever lived. I would suggest that you listen to his "Titan" symphony (No. 1). It's incredible! Some of his stuff gets a bit tedious, but the Titan symphony is easy to listen to and appreciate without having to be a "Mahler expert."

Mahler's symphonies can be extremely tedious at times, yet beautiful at others.

-Symphony No. 2 in C Minor, "Resurrection", Mvt 4-

That's a great piece of music, mainly because Mahler gets to the point and doesn't drag it on and on, as with almost every other symphonic movement he wrote. I also love the last movement of his 9th, but find that he could have trimmed it and achieved the same effect. Basically, I think that Mahler took the Romantic ideal and abused it.

I, for one, don't consider him to be even close to the greatest, but greatly respect the opinion of those who do as I see warrent in it. In your case, I'm not surprised that you consider him the greatest, as I hear a very strong Mahler influence in this symphony.

(I know this is really a side note to the topic at hand, that being your symphony, but Mahler has always been a puzzle to me and so I felt compelled to post this.)

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I just used a GPO mp3 for my concerto...lol DISPROVED THAT!

just kidding...i got yelled at for doing the same thing about a year ago ....

Well, as I don't expect advanced critique myself for any work which I wrote before 2003 (which this symphony certainly is) I don't think it's unfair that I don't comment on the works of others. With many of the works I'll share here, I merely want feedback, not necessarily evaluation.

By the way, your concerto was a great piece of music.

Best,

John Carey

Second Movement: The first part of the motif reminds me of Elfman.

A+

Thanks much. Which Elfman score do you have in mind, exactly?

Best regards,

John Carey

if anyone's interested I recommand Mahler's first for beginners, then perhaps the 4th, 5th, 2nd, 9th. Liking mahler is an "acquired taste", I remember the first time I heard the third movement in mahler's second symphony, i felt that it was some strange, crazy bohemian music, but, when i heard the opening of his First symphony first movement, I was immediately addicted to the beauty his first symphony, Mahler is not like those classicist, who give you beauty throughout the piece, you have to struggle with him to glimpse at beauty(sometimes only briefly), but at times suffer with him, because he composes from his heart, I have done extensive research at a nearby university on Mahler, and if only the people here know a little more about Mahler the Person, perhaps you will come to understand his music a little better.

my advice is, never say that you dislike mahler after one hearing, listen and listen to it again, eventually you will get it

my advice is, never say that you dislike mahler after one hearing, listen and listen to it again, eventually you will get it

Sorry Mr. Carey for keeping this going on your symphony's thread, but I agree. It took me many attempts before I came to admire Mahler's music, and even appreciate it. The 9th Symphony, 4th Movement and 2nd Symphony, 5th Movement did it for me. I recommend those to newcomers (esp. the 2nd Sym, Mvt 5 for those new to Mahler's music), they are majestic!

I love Mahler's 2nd symphony, but I can rarely listen to it. I always lose it at the ending. I find that I'm in tears for hours after listening to it. It happens to be the only piece that has ever moved me that much. It's probably the greatest piece I've heard, but I fear it's a bit "too much" for me at times.

I still would recommend the 1st symphony as a starting point. Then the 2nd. If one is still interested, they should check out his 5th and 9th symphonies. Then one should listen to the rest of them.

I'll be honest, some are much better than others, but I think that they are all very good pieces, and some are amazing in a way that I can't even describe.

I find his 8th rather overbearing - way too many performers and sub-par music.

But on the topic of the 5th, how can you go wrong with the adagietto!

I agree that that 1st is a good starting point.

On a side note, I also agree that your music is fantastic Mr. Carey! Not much else I can say... the 2nd movement is majestic!