Kyrie (SATB)

I do not often write for choir. But I thought, let's write a Kyrie, and perhaps a whole mass. This is the kyrie I wrote.

Please give some feedback, comments, so I can improve choral writing.

Kyrie.mp3

Attach a PDF please, my finale won't open the file. Thanks!

The PDF is added ;)

Not really interesting, hm?

I like it. The Organ parts add interest to it immensely. Only question I have is originally you have the chorus sing: Ky-ri-e E-le-i-son, a little towards the end of the piece- however - you have them do E-lei-son. Is the change intentional?

Thank you :)

The times they sing 'E-le-i-son' has 'i' it's own note.

When they sing 'E-lei-son', it still sounds as 'e-i-son'.. (E-leeeeeeeeeeeeee-i-sooon) They're not singing something like 'Elison' or whatever.

Sorry, my English is not that good, hope you understand what I'm trying to tell.

Yes, I do. From my experience, however, you can do either or. The actual pronunciation or the 'bastardized' (E-le-i-son or E-leh-son). A good example can be found in the various performances of Mozart's Kyrie in d minor and in his Requiem. I mention those because he was very good at composing for chorus - imo. Needless to say, its semantics...lol

I'm for E-le-i-son :). Suggestions for improving my composing?

I'm for E-le-i-son :). Suggestions for improving my composing?

Well, the Christe portion was a little too short, imo. Seems like something there is missing. Have you given any thought to perhaps using fugal technique there to expand it? Generally, in Kyrie movements, one states the Kyrie 3x - the Christe 3x - and then the Kyrie again 3x. However, your theme in the soprano would lend itself very nice to a fugal texture. Another suggestion, since you have the Organ Ostinato underneath, would be to have an expanded contrapuntal section for 4 all for parts soli. That doesn't necessarily HAVE to be fugal - but would expand the section to fit the 'traditional' setting requirement of 3x3x3x. Make sense?

Fugal techniques, nice idea :). The 'Christe-part' with 4 solo-singers, singing sort of fugue, I think I'm going to use that.

But your whole thing about Organ Ostinato, though I know what it is, I do not really understand what you are meaning to say.

Fugal techniques, nice idea :). The 'Christe-part' with 4 solo-singers, singing sort of fugue, I think I'm going to use that.

But your whole thing about Organ Ostinato, though I know what it is, I do not really understand what you are meaning to say.

I use the term Ostinato fairly liberally. What i'm referring to in this case is your use of the triplet 8th pattern in the right hand of the organ. Technically, that can be considered to be an ostinato pattern.

Here is the exact definition from Dolmetsch Online Music Dictionary:

(English, German m., Italian, literally 'persistent') a short, repeating pattern (melodic, harmonic, rhythmic, movement) which is intended to be performed together with a melody:

melodic ostinato a short, repeated melody pattern which is intended to be performed together with another melody to produce harmony

basso ostinato a short, repeated melody pattern in the bass

harmonic ostinato a short, repeated chordal accompaniment pattern which is intended to be performed along with a melody

rhythmic ostinato for example in 'isorhythm', where repeated rhythmic patterns (called the talea), usually occurring in the tenor line, are set against a pattern of notes or pitches (called the 'colour') - the talea and colour may be different in length

Yeah, I understand :)

Ehm, and you meant 4 soloists would sing a fugue-like thing instead of the quite basic thing now? Not really fugue perhaps, but contrapunctual thing.

yes, if thats what you want to try. Do you study choral scores?

Hm, I do not really. But we sang 'Kyrie from Mass in G' by Schubert with our school choir. I think that had some influence in this composition.

I expanded the 'Christe' piece with 'fugue-like' things. But I think I lost a little the cohesion.

Perhaps there are too many ideas put in one piece.

Kyrie

The cohesion can be fixed easily with a return back to the kyrie section from the beginning. Your expansion of the Christe section is much nicer. Remember with your ostinato pattern - prevalent throughout - that you have a nice mechanism to modulate/return to the Kyrie from the beginning. Doing that will structurally make this ABA' form - fixing the sense of cohesion. Very nice!

Thank you! I think that's a good idea. And I think I'm going to use the triplets in the fugue-part. It's a little strange how the triplets stop. Thank you for advice :)

I think this is the final version. I'm still not really sure about the ending, perhaps to boring.

Any suggestions? :)

Kyrie

Nice expansion. The only part I see that might need a tweeking is on page 6 where you have the call and response (sopranos then orchestra.) That seems to stop the flow of motion a little bit. Other than that... fine job!

I'm going to remove that, first I used it to work to the ending. Thank you for your advice during the composing. :)

ah. np, i hope i was helpful.

you were

No more thoughts?

I listened to it first and thought there was something weird going on, so I looked at the PDF.

I noticed two main things.

1. The organ left hand doesn't really feel like a left hand, more a secondary bass, and it rather low, often joining the already low pedal part.

2. On one occasion, you doubled-up the pedal part, in its low register by making the pedal play a fifth. If you do that, you are simulating a stop lower. So, if you double up at that register on an 8ft pedal stop, you will get a simulated 16ft pedal note, and the lower you go, the better the simulation will sound. But this simulation is created by the harmonics created by playing two notes a 5th apart. So the chord at that point will sound very low and very 'trembling' - maybe that was the intention.

Apart from that, a good job. Not my kind of music, but hey, we are all different!

I hope you've taken the last-uploaded-pieces.

1. I'm not really familiar with organ composing, so I tried something. What would be better for left hand?

2. I do not really understand your point, my english is not that good. I think it's a good idea to make the pedal notes higher.

More advice? Do you think the piece is coherent?