How Low, for saxes and bass

This piece is for a small bigband, where the bariton and the soprano sax are good players, and the guitarist refuses to read notes. So he gets only a dull part and this is not included in the next mp3:

http://members.chello.nl/w.boeke/bigband/how-low-midi.mp3

The score:

http://members.chello.nl/w.boeke/bigband/how-low.pdf

I work as follows:

First I devise some melodies, then I combine them, then I make them polyphonic, then I find out what might be the appropriate chords, then I add guitar and bass. It appears that finding the chords is much work, still I cannot start with the chords. I simply am not able to. If somebody has a good advice, I would be happy.

Wouter

the bariton and the soprano sax are good players, and the guitarist refuses to read notes.

You can get used to that. :)

The piece is interesting at times, but I have to say it didn't keep my attention the whole piece through. There seems to be little development and little contrast in dynamics. I also notice you haven't written dynamic markings; this is a must! Just this would already liven up the piece considerably.

Some questions:

Is it supposed to be swing or straight eights? You didn't specify and midi sounds horrible for jazz no matter how hard you want it to be okay :)

And what's with the drum part? Is he supposed to play only what is written? Also, the notation is a bit weird. A short note on a beat should be notated as a quarter note (if you want to be extra clear, add a "^" accent). This isn't just for the drum bart by the way.

As for the chords, you would probably benefit from studying basic jazz harmony, so you learn how to think more functionally in chords (tonic, dominant, subdominant, and their typical progressions). There's tons of good books out there.

Another small comment: as far as I know, jazz musicians aren't used to the chord G4 or D4. Better to write Gsus, Gsus4 or G7sus (the latter is most often used, as jazz chords usually contain sevenths).

Hope it helped

The piece is interesting at times, but I have to say it didn't keep my attention the whole piece through.

How dare you ... ;) Still, thank you for your comments.

There seems to be little development and little contrast in dynamics. I also notice you haven't written dynamic markings; this is a must! Just this would already liven up the piece considerably.

Hey, this is a forum for composers, you don't have to deliver a professional sounding end product. About those dynamic markings: we (the bigband that I am playing in) never see dynamic markings in our scores, the conductor tells us how to play the different parts. The timing is the most important, not the dynamics. If you try to emulate that on a computer the result will be disgusting most of the time.

Is it supposed to be swing or straight eights? You didn't specify and midi sounds horrible for jazz no matter how hard you want it to be okay.

That's right. Real musicians forever!

And what's with the drum part? Is he supposed to play only what is written?

Now you've got me. I write my own (open source) software, and the drum part needs upgrading. However, our drummer hardly ever looks at his score, so why should I bother?

As for the chords, you would probably benefit from studying basic jazz harmony, so you learn how to think more functionally in chords (tonic, dominant, subdominant, and their typical progressions). There's tons of good books out there.

Who said that this piece is jazz? There are some jazz influences but not much. About the books: I read several of them, and I know that I should start with the chords beforehand. That's not easy, because good melodies jump into my head now and then, and I want to use them. Finding a melody that fits a given chord progression is something that's not natural for me. Actually I joined this forum in order to find out how other composers are working.

Hey, this is a forum for composers, you don't have to deliver a professional sounding end product. About those dynamic markings: we (the bigband that I am playing in) never see dynamic markings in our scores, the conductor tells us how to play the different parts. The timing is the most important, not the dynamics. If you try to emulate that on a computer the result will be disgusting most of the time.

Well, if it works for you and the big band you play in, you can ignore any rule and convention you want (I'm not being sarcastic). But just so you know, pretty much any other musician will want to know how they have to play. And this isn't just fortes and pianos, you also don't write accents, slurs, anything but the notes, really. And as the composer, you are the one who knows what dynamic effects fit at which point in the piece. Even if you arrange this stuff during rehearsal, you'll still get a much "flatter" piece than if you had specified these things. If this isn't a problem to you, then you don't need to fix it. I'm just telling you this is one of the main reasons your piece didn't keep my attention, and it's relatively easy to fix.

Now you've got me. I write my own (open source) software, and the drum part needs upgrading. However, our drummer hardly ever looks at his score, so why should I bother?

Same answer, I guess, if it works for you and for him, sure. But it isn't what a drum part usually looks like, and a different drummer will be confused. And the main problem isn't the software, it's the notation; like I said, quarter notes on the beat, slash notation instead of rests unless the drummer should actually stop playing.

Who said that this piece is jazz? There are some jazz influences but not much. About the books: I read several of them, and I know that I should start with the chords beforehand. That's not easy, because good melodies jump into my head now and then, and I want to use them. Finding a melody that fits a given chord progression is something that's not natural for me. Actually I joined this forum in order to find out how other composers are working.

I would advise against writing chords before melodies. Any book that tells you to write chords first is insanely wrong. I personally almost always start with a melody (and when I don't, the piece is really based around the harmony). But in learning jazz harmony, you will learn to harmonize these melodies in a way that sound more logical. It doesn't even have to jazz harmony, even classical harmony would do. Just to give you a sense of the diatonic functions in a scale.

a different drummer will be confused. And the main problem isn't the software, it's the notation; like I said, quarter notes on the beat, slash notation instead of rests unless the drummer should actually stop playing.

Thanks for all your advice. By the way, the notation really is a software problem: I enter the notes as horizontal lines (for the instruments) or dots (for the percussion) in one big staff. If the music sounds right, I click a button and the complete score is generated.

Aha, I get it.

Good notation programs are great, but expensive. If you ever write for a different band, you'll need it though (or write everything by hand...) Of course, it's completely up to you.

Good luck in any case.