HELP, PROGRAM MUSIC INDICENTAL MUSIC

Hi guys

I have a question about Programmatic music is similar an Incidental music? is the same?

the nacionalism music is programatic?

im writing an university job about it, but i have doubt, because the program music is imitative, descriptive, suggestive, narrative, ect..

the incidental music is similar but depends of the images, movie , theater.

i think that function is equal or similar in both cases.

i find a book about of program music but there is the overtures of beethoven, tchaikovsky, edvarg grieg music for peer gynt, mendelsohn overtures

im very confused with it.

i appreciate your comments, opinions and help.

im sorry for my english =)

thanks

Alex Ab.

I think of it as a difference in the degree of "completeness," where Programmatic music tends to be more like a novel while Incidental music may be written as more like a collection of short essays in terms of literature. Incidental music may indeed be "programmatic" as a collection, but a Programmatic piece will more often express itself completely from beginning to end without randomly excusing itself from the narrative the way Incidental music often does. An action scene may take place in a movie, which may be a complete departure from the romantic idea that was just heard in the previous scene. In a Programmatic work, the romantic idea will often be completed or more thoroughly developed in one section - timing and transitions won't be as big of an issue.

Incidental music is also structured differently. We write Incidental music as a series of cues from blocks of scenes in a film. Programmatic music isn't necessarily done this way. Often it's more fluid, follows a narrative flow with smoother musical ideas and transitions, and generally makes more musical sense because the program doesn't necessarily force the composer to depart from one idea to another the way a film would require a composer to capture a specific mood at a specific moment. That's just my take on it, though. There are plenty of people here who could offer more insight. I suggest posing this question to Marius, John Axon, and generally anyone who regularly posts in the Film and Game Music upload forums. Those are the members who can most assuredly give you some great insight into your inquiry. Good luck!

I think of it as a difference in the degree of "completeness," where Programmatic music tends to be more like a novel while Incidental music may be written as more like a collection of short essays in terms of literature. Incidental music may indeed be "programmatic" as a collection, but a Programmatic piece will more often express itself completely from beginning to end without randomly excusing itself from the narrative the way Incidental music often does. An action scene may take place in a movie, which may be a complete departure from the romantic idea that was just heard in the previous scene. In a Programmatic work, the romantic idea will often be completed or more thoroughly developed in one section - timing and transitions won't be as big of an issue.

Incidental music is also structured differently. We write Incidental music as a series of cues from blocks of scenes in a film. Programmatic music isn't necessarily done this way. Often it's more fluid, follows a narrative flow with smoother musical ideas and transitions, and generally makes more musical sense because the program doesn't necessarily force the composer to depart from one idea to another the way a film would require a composer to capture a specific mood at a specific moment. That's just my take on it, though. There are plenty of people here who could offer more insight. I suggest posing this question to Marius, John Axon, and generally anyone who regularly posts in the Film and Game Music upload forums. Those are the members who can most assuredly give you some great insight into your inquiry. Good luck!

AntiA, thanks for your comments

i hope that others participate and share..

i will ask to Marius or John Axon, c ya

I think incidental music is more "functional" in that there is a specific image, scene etc. with which it is associated while I consider programme music to convey a general theme and is more abstract.

You write incidental music to accompany something else (film, play, commercial, TV show, video game).

Program music directs a narrative and doesn't have to accompany something else (Lizst's Les préludes). Think tone poem, symphonic poem, etc.

Ballet music is ballet music, and opera is opera (though they contain elements of both).

Hi Alex,

Welcome to YC. I am not sure that I have much to say to add to what the wise folks before me have said, but I will point out to you that focusing on the semantics of what it's called seems like an unnecessary distraction. It's just words. If you're writing music then just focus on the music and forget about labels.

In terms of the actual distinction between the two terms though, my understanding is that "program music" is something of an umbrella term. It's the category under which you find more specific genres like incidental music, ballet music, opera music, etc. I really like Charlie's answer though because it makes the distinction clear: program music is self-directed and independent, telling its own story all by itself, whereas incidental music is necessarily accompanying something else and assisting rather than being on its own.

Hi Alex,

Welcome to YC. I am not sure that I have much to say to add to what the wise folks before me have said, but I will point out to you that focusing on the semantics of what it's called seems like an unnecessary distraction. It's just words. If you're writing music then just focus on the music and forget about labels.

In terms of the actual distinction between the two terms though, my understanding is that "program music" is something of an umbrella term. It's the category under which you find more specific genres like incidental music, ballet music, opera music, etc. I really like Charlie's answer though because it makes the distinction clear: program music is self-directed and independent, telling its own story all by itself, whereas incidental music is necessarily accompanying something else and assisting rather than being on its own.

I want to say thanks to all for the comments...

Alex Ab