Lesson with Jordan

Jazz...

Where to begin... Jordan!? What do you know about:

Chords?

Scales & modes?

Lemme know!

:sadtears:

well... it's hard to say. a lot :sadtears:

I recently went to a jazz festival in Kincardine, Ontario. (Canada). I was taught by Canadian jazz greats, like Alex Dean, Mike Malone and Dave McMurdo (with whom I am taking a jazz composition course on the 7th of September). this was a crazy good experience, that left me wanting more. I received a very big compliment, also, from Dave, after my first solo there, over a G blues progression :

" I hate the clarinet. the only time I like it is when Phil Nimmons plays it, and even then it's just ok. that was pretty damn good, for a clarinet."

anyhow, I digress. I received a lesson from Alex Dean about bop. I have always enjoyed bop solos, and I have always loved that sound, the sound that seems just like random 16th runs, just pulled out of nowhere to the untrained ear. I never knew what it was called until now, and I really want to continue to learn it.

I will say this : I love composition, and I want to compose jazz stuff. I've gotten a start, in fact you've even commented on one of mine, and that's fine. eventually, it would be cool to learn various composition techs, but seeing as I will be learning from Mike Malone and Dave McMurdo in a week and a half, I think that I would instead, like you to talk to me about bop, when to use it, over what chords, and how to put together a solo with it. I know that it's fairly general. but, why don't we start with the basics, and work up. a lot of it will be re-iteration for me, but that's good.

so, in summary, bop basics. what it is, what scales to use it on, and how to put together a cohesive solo. starting with the beginners' guide. thanks in advance!

Cool. Dave McMurdo is a killing writer of straight-ahead charts...and all those T.O. cats can play their asses off. Where are you working with them - a workshop or school setting?

Anyway...to approach improv in a boppish sense, you need to maintain a sense of melody, harmony, and forward motion. It's tough to outline harmony whilst being melodic, with energy. SO, you need a clear idea of where you're going, and how you're gonna get there.

First - know the tune. Cold. Inside and out. Know the melody; know the form; know the changes; know the words (?! ...yeah). There's kind of two aspects to improvisation: Linear, and vertical.

Linear is exactly that - thinking in a lateral motion, melodically, aiming two bars, 8 bars, a whole chorus, 4 choruses down the line.

Vertical is a more traditional approach - thinking in chord-tones and target notes.

Incorporating both aspects is key; maintaining a good line while nailing the changes...

Okay...the abridged chord/scale stuff:

Bop and most swing-based jazz-type music centres around a key. ii-V-I (see Autumn Leaves) or I-vi-ii-V-I (Oleo). You can use the same scale over chunks of the form.

Gmin7 // C7 // FMaj7

Gmin7 = Dorian = 2nd mode of F Major

C7 = Mixolydian = 5th mode of F Major

FMaj7 = Ionian = 1st mode of F Major

No problem!

I - Ionian - Maj7

ii - Dorian - min7

iii - Phrygian - min7(b9)

IV - Lydian - Maj7(#11)

V - Mixolydian - 7

vi - Aeolian - min7(b6)

vii - Locrian -

I think for the most part this is clear, but let me re-iterate in my own words to see whether I'm just under a delusion of knowledge.

the song is in C. I encounter this chord : Cmaj7(#11). upon seeing that, I start to solo in the lydian mode, which in this case just means playing C major starting on F. is that about right?

also, upon seeing this chord, I do various fancy things. then, Dmin7 comes up, and I play around, ending the bar on an c, and then going down to an Bb at the beginning of the next bar, which works because the next chord is G, and this is a ii-IV progression. is this kinda right? or are there some holes?

also, I was in a sort of workshop setting with those guys. Alex Dean did master classes in the Morning, we broke for lunch, and then I went to my ensemble, which did a bunch of tunes. Mike and Dave lead the ensemble. repeat this every day for a week. it was awesome. it was done in a highschool, though... :thumbsup: so it's combination :)

...I encounter this chord : Cmaj7(#11). upon seeing that, I start to solo in the lydian mode, which in this case just means playing C major starting on F. is that about right?

Almost. CMaj7(#11) does indeed indicate the lydian mode, but it would be C Lydian, not F; meaning the 4th mode of G-Major. Whichever root you have for the chord, is the root/tonic of your mode.

Try this: What's the parent major-scale of these modes?

• Ab Dorian
  
• F Mixolydian
  
• Eb Phrygian
  
• G Lydian
  
• D Aeolian
  

What mode is indicated by these chord symbols?

[*]Fmin7

[*]G7

[*]A

alrighty, here we go.

* Ab Dorian = GbMaj

* F Mixolydian = BbMaj

* Eb Phrygian = BMaj.. and I think that it should actually be D# Phyrgian, no? because BMaj is cited using sharps, not flats?

* G Lydian = DMaj

* D Aeolian = FMaj

and the other set :

* Fmin7 = dorian

* G7 = mixolydian

* A

Everything looks good, I'll clarify oine point:

* Eb Phrygian = BMaj.. and I think that it should actually be D# Phyrgian, no? because BMaj is cited using sharps, not flats?

Either way, looks like you're solid. No realbook? Do you have leadsheets for tunes or anything? I'll lay some on you when we get into it...

well, what's a realbook, hook me up. I have some lead sheets, yea, but you probably have better ones, seeing as you are university for it.

and yea, I was thinking that it should be Cb to go along with it.. but then I thought he wouldn't be that arrogant ;) Cb? who uses that? (and don't answer every famous composer plus blah, blah blah...)

well, what's a realbook, hook me up. I have some lead sheets

a Realbook (or fakebook) is just a collection of leadsheets and tunes. When necessary, I'll post pdfs of tunes we'll look at for changes and such.

...and yea, I was thinking that it should be Cb to go along with it.. but then I thought he wouldn't be that arrogant :) Cb? who uses that?

:D ;) :)

alright, so I know about modes. what's next? let's keep going, I like what you're doing so far.

By the way... another thing that I would be interested to know is WHEN to use this. this whole playing certain modes over certain chords, that's cool... but wouldn't it just mean that you are simply playing over the exact same scale all the time...? ah, but I suppose not... I'm thinking linearly... I'm thinking in that ii-IV thing, for example. but, I suppose composers have (obviously) put scales in jazz that are "out" of the tonic scale, so I suppose that's where this kind of thing would be more useful?

I suppose I'm just kind of looking at the practical "what can I use this for" thing.

also, I'm sure this leads smoothly into bop? perhaps making bop scale based on that mode? I think I might be ready to move on now, because I'm asking too many questions :P

...another thing that I would be interested to know is WHEN to use this. ... I'm thinking linearly......composers have (obviously) put scales in jazz that are "out" of the tonic scale, so I suppose that's where this kind of thing would be more useful?

...

I'll be a little more available soon - what we're going to do is look specifically at some leadsheets.

When you say 'out of the tonic' are you thinking tonic as the key of the tune? OR, the key of the moment? You might play 'All The Things You Are' in Ab, but it goes many MANY other places...which is where knowing which chords are from which key is important.

Soon, I'll upload a chart to look at and dig into where this stuff fits into it. Eventually getting into 'substitutions' and 'side-stepping' and other fun stuff

:)

Stay tuned.

awesome stuff.. I am waiting with trepidation :P jazz band at my school has already started, and next week we start to play, so I am hoping to see what you have got to show me soon!

Okay, since both lessons are headed in a similar direction, I'm going to copy & paste this: how to approach melodic content, a start at least.

What you need to do is be aware of two parts of all this. Chords and scales. Chords and chord-tones are what sound good, and let listeners know you know what you're doing. Scales are good for connecting everything together; again, so you sound like you know what you're doing.

Attached is a leadsheet for the Kern/Hammerstein tune 'All The Things You Are'.

Now, chord tones - a good way to organize yourself melodically is with 'target notes'. It may be at the end of a 4 measure phrase, in the middle of an 8th-note run, or at some main tonal shift in the tune. The point is, to have a clear goal in sight, and a clear way to get there.

Guide Tones (not sure if I mentioned these here): are the third and seventh of a chord. These notes make up the meat & potatoes of the chord. 1 and 5 are merely filler, and have little to do with defining the chord; 9, 11, 13 are simply color. The 3rd defines major/minor. 7th, dominant/otherwise.

A cool thing about 3rds and 7ths appears when you analyze the ii-V7-I progression. Looking at All The Things, measures 2-4.

Bbmin7 ... Eb7 ... AbMaj7.

We all know the construction of 7th chords, right?

Start on the 3rd of Bbmin7: Db.

What's the next logical choice, for Eb7? Db. (7th)

And for AbMaj7? C (3rd)

Flows nicely: Db, Db, C.

Works the other way too

7th of Bbmin7: Ab

3rd of Eb7: G

7th of AbMaj7: G

Alternating 3rds and 7ths makes a nicely contoured line: works beautifully for backgrounds. These work well for target notes in improvisation.

Quickie assignment: For each chord, pick a single note, find a line that flows nicely through the changes. Avoid 1 if at all possible...5 is okay...3rd or 7th preferable.

...in 4-measure phrases:

C Db Db C | C B B-B |

Bb Ab Ab G | G F# F#-F# | G F# F#-F#||

A A G#-G# | Ab Ab G G

F E Eb D | Db Db C-C ||

Another one:

Ab Ab G G | F F E-E |

Eb Eb D D | C C B-B | C C B-B ||

E D# D# E | Eb Db Db C |

C B Bb A | Ab G G-G ||

Dunno how it sounds as a whole, but it goes to show that a simple line can be found to weave through the changes. Looking at the melody for All The Things you'll notice that it uses (for the most part) 3rds of the chord. Neat, eh?!

Now, what to do is to pick one of these notes as a target, and utilize scales/modes to aproach and unify them.

SO: looking at the tune, can you identify the parent major (or minor) scale for each chord?

....aaaaaaand.....GO!

All The Things You Are: leadsheet.

huh. alright. I won't put up my answers what with the quickie assignment, because I just kind of thought of it and forgot it... it's kind of spur of the moment. as should be with jazz ;)

however. the scales.

it should go like this. I'm just going to cite the Parent Major/minor scales, so it will look weird... consult the original (also, because they are mostly minor, I will just put the letter UNLESS it is minor, then I will denote it.)

E Ab Ab Ab

Db C C C

Bb Eb Eb Eb

Ab G G G

G G G G

E E E ???... augmented. well, erm... E? the G# in E would match the augmented fifth in C...

Eb Ab Ab Ab

Db B Bb um... I think that's Diminished? so, um... I'm gonna take a wild guess and say C, because I think that that shares the most notes.

Ab Ab Ab C F.

so... erm.... any good? I think that wasn't bad.

also, you just inadvertently taught me (or maybe on purpose, and you are brilliant) how to write better chord Progressions. thanks. and keep this stuff up, I like it :(

...also, you just inadvertently taught me (or maybe on purpose, and you are brilliant) how to write better chord Progressions.

I'm glad you got something out of it. It's cool to see how a great progression stays in a key centre for a while, and also how it moves around.

There were a couple places that tripped you up - simply because it's not something we've mentioned yet.

Anyway.

Do you also see how a simple melody can be developed over/through the changes? ...

Now I'll mention a couple of new scales/chords. Synthetic scales are those that do not exist naturally in any major/minor scales. The first one you stumbled upon was the C+7 augmented chord.

C+7 = C E G# Bb [could also be notated as C7#5]

Along with this we uncover the whole-tone scale. Pretty straight-forward. There's only two of them possible, built entirely of (duh) whole-steps:

C D E Gb Ab Bb

Db Eb F G A B

The same scale is used for any augmented chord with that root... i.e. the D whole-tone and Ab whole-tone scales are identical; likewise with F and Db and so on...

Make sense?!

The other chord you ran into was B

oh, so whole tone scales work over augmented chords? see, I was wondering about that.

also, the diminished scales, yes, I know what they are, but that was a neat perspective. cool. so... what's next?

...so... what's next?

Practice. :shifty:

You're wanting to apply this stuff to your playing, right?

Get some leadsheets (Easy standards: Autumn Leaves, Summertime, Beautiful Love), practice them: learn the melody; arpeggiate the chords. Get some Aebersolds (Volume 1 is actually very useful); write a solo; transcibe someone elses solo; listen to records and play along......

Let me know if you want some more charts, or even to 'borrow' some Aebersold tracks...

I would very much like some more sheets. I would love autumn leaves, because I don't have that... actually, really, all I have right now is "My favorite things", "lullaby of Birdland", and that's about it. so, any standards that you could hook me up with would be great. (open up the floodgates, I swear, my hard drive can take it. :shifty: )

also, some of the abersolds would be nice too... but then again, if you don't want to be risky, I'm cool with the sheets.

...if you don't want to be risky, I'm cool with the

sheets.

I like to live dangerously... stay tuned. (Do you use iTunes? Would save the .m4a >> .mp3 transformation)

no, I don't have iTunes. people keep on telling me I should, though.

also, another thing. I also play the piano, and I am getting a lot more into jazz with it now. I'm wondering : how much do you know about chord voicings in piano? like, how someone makes G6 sound so much better than just G, B, D, and E? if you don't know much about it, cool, but I've been all about that stuff recently, and It would be great to learn.

no, I don't have iTunes. people keep on telling me I should, though.

No worries...

...also, another thing. I also play the piano, and I am getting a lot more into jazz with it now. I'm wondering : how much do you know about chord voicings in piano? like, how someone makes G6 sound so much better than just G, B, D, and E? if you don't know much about it, cool, but I've been all about that stuff recently, and It would be great to learn.

Okay...

I'm no jazz pianist - I have limited skill, but will pass on what I know (later, need to think about it a bit). in the meantime, I'll recommend the Mark Levine Jazz Piano Book.

...

so did Pat Collins. oh! I never told you about the composition camp I went to, did I?

there were 6 pros there, some I didn't know, but there were three I did know : Mike Malone, Dave McMurdo, and Pat Collins. basically, there were only 12 students, so it was 2 people to a pro, and the other guy in my group left to go re-write his piece. so, I had 4 hours alone with Pat Collins, talking about composition. it was awesome. I learned so much.

he also recommended that book.. and I definitely am on the lookout.

so did Pat Collins. oh! I never told you about the composition camp I went to, did I?

there were 6 pros there, some I didn't know, but there were three I did know : Mike Malone, Dave McMurdo, and Pat Collins. basically, there were only 12 students, so it was 2 people to a pro, and the other guy in my group left to go re-write his piece. so, I had 4 hours alone with Pat Collins, talking about composition. it was awesome. I learned so much.

Dude...where do you live? You can't be too far from Toronto...

I'm not. Orangeville. about an hour or so north. that camp was in Guelph, though. actually, in a place called eden mills, a tiny little place in Guelph.

/me reminds robin of the want of various lead sheets