Composing for a Living?

I've always wanted to be three things:

1) A composer

2) A performer (in like either a) a symphonic orchestra or b) a movie orchestra type thing)

or

3) a computer geek person (like programmer)

I guess the easiest of them all would be a computer geek but I have ALWAYS loved music, I play just about everything and i've always been good at picking up instruments and learning them to a decent level within a day or two.

But then about 5 years ago, i found out about this cool amazing wonderful thing.. called composing.

I guess i just never realized that somebody has to write all that stuff that i played. I downloaded finale (back when I ran windows) and tried to write something, i can't remember what it was now, but it sounded pretty cool to me (when i was 10)

Now 5 years later I still like composing, i'm not too good but I have some general grasp of how to write stuff. I can't really put big cool sounding chords down because I have never learned them, so what I write is mostly basic and simple sounding, mostly in minor keys 'cause i like 'em (and when you compose it's what you like, who cares what everyone else thinks? =P)

So now i'm nearing 16 and just 2 more years before college where I have to decide what I want to do for the rest of my life (or at least most of my life) and since I'm pretty good on Bassoon and piano and sax I might have a good shot at some sort of scholarship (but even if I get one I'm going to Julliard, no matter what it takes [okay maybe i was kidding, but we all gotta have dreams, right? XD])

I was pondering the question of "What do I want to be when I grow up?" the other day on our 10 hour drive to the Lake of the Ozarks, and I think that what I really really would LOVE to do is compose. I don't care if I become the next John Williams or if I just write small short pieces for solo piano or if I write orchestrations that the Symphonic Orchestra plays, I want to write music for a living, and, if I don't make anything from it to actually live, I'm sure I could get a job performing somewhere. (But it would be cool to be known like some of those big composers, e.g. John Williams, 'cause he will be in his late 80s I believe once I get outta college XD)

SO, after that big long life story (which will probably not turn out that long, it just looks long in this typing thingy) I come to my question: How do you make yourself known?

I'm sure I'll be a decent composer, have have a lot more knowledge at least in composing (i'll be taking music theory next year) but once I get into college, how do I make myself known to the rest of the world (or at least the state) so people might think about hiring me?

My ultimate goal is to write for some TV show, doesn't matter what I would just love writing for a tv show.

and, like I do in just about every thread i make, I have no idea how to bring it all to a close, so... i'm done :D

-Smart.A1ec-

Charisma and connections.

Programmer. :)

Programmer. :)

XD

ahh the sweet smell of givin up..

hey, if i had that mentality i wouldn't have learned how to water ski two days ago :)

I'm pretty good on Bassoon and piano and sax

Sax == if you want an uphill battle... classical musicians tend to treat saxophonists poorly.

Bassoon == Profit!

LOL! Yes indeed! If you want to be a performer, play either bassoon, or oboe, or english horn, or perhaps viola. Rarities in instruments make you valuable. Remember, every Mahler symphony has at least 3 bassoons in it!

Piano isn't too bad if you're willing to give lessons. There may be a million of other pianists, but there are also millions of students. And you can always pair it with stuff like correpetition/accompaniment. Or even get a minor organist job in a small church, if you can play the organ a bit, which often isn't paid too badly. (Of course never so well as if you were an actual organist.)

If you want to get into a good orchestra, you need to be excellent, no matter what your instrument is. And orchestra life isn't always just fun.

...If you want to be a performer, play either bassoon, or oboe, or english horn, or perhaps viola. Rarities in instruments make you valuable.

Another option is to just not suck. :whistling:

ANYWAY...

Is it possible to make a living as a composer or performer?

Absolutely. If you have the dedication, drive, and passion for the art, you can do anything... depending on what 'making a living' is to you. Levels of 'success' vary greatly from one person to the next.

It requires a lot of effort and perseverance, but if you have the heart for it, and take it seriously it's definitely possible...remember, you get out what you put in.

I think the biggest problem with your whole outlook here is that you think that when you go to college, you have to decide what you're going to do for the rest of your life. I got into Whalen school of music at Ithaca as a clarinet education major...and then decided that I wanted absolutely nothing to do with it, even though I had played and dedicated myself to it for over 8 years.

Now, I'm heading into the field of forensic psychology, and will soon be going for a JD and a PhD conjointly. Do I still compose? Yes. Do I wish that my parents had let me go for composition? Sometimes, yes. Do I regret switching majors? Hellz no....it opened up a whole new world for me. Now I do research about eyewitness testimony and I'm a part of a team that's researching the latest in treatment of Autism.

what I'm trying to get at is that you don't need to decide to become a composer at 16 - thee most popular thing to do in college is change majors, lol. It's all up to you, and how big of a part you think music will play in your life. Even if you get into a great school, making a living as a composer is very difficult nowadays.

I say, go to college as undecided, take as many classes in different majors as you possibly can, and still compose. :)

Piano == you and a million other pianists.

Sax == if you want an uphill battle... classical musicians tend to treat saxophonists poorly.

Bassoon == Profit!

that is, almost exactaly what my band director told me..

then he was telling my mom when you audition on bassoon for a scholarship for college it's like

*blat*

Judge: *gasp* you can make a sound come out of that stick! *hands full ride scholarship*

Piano isn't too bad if you're willing to give lessons. There may be a million of other pianists, but there are also millions of students. And you can always pair it with stuff like correpetition/accompaniment. Or even get a minor organist job in a small church, if you can play the organ a bit, which often isn't paid too badly. (Of course never so well as if you were an actual organist.)

If you want to get into a good orchestra, you need to be excellent, no matter what your instrument is. And orchestra life isn't always just fun.

i am currently giving lessons (to younger students, like 5-10) and have around 8 students... not much but i just started teaching like end of school year..

I have 0 students. Perform on one of the most competetive instruments (trumpet) and want to go into music.

HAHAHAHA

Oh that sounded funny to me for some reason. I shall try any way. My private teacehr seems to think I could make it. Mainly I need to become more assertive.

Find me a musician who only does one thing. There's no reason you can't be a programmer while teaching during the after school hours, playing in a band with friends and finding late-night and weekend gigs while doing your own compositions when you can.

Don't count on composing to make you money right away. You'll do a lot of composing because it's what you love before anyone pays you for it. Luckily, if you love teaching, that's a wonderful job to have to make money while you wait for your "big break." And being a computer programmer, a teacher and a composer can all happen simultaneously. You may decide that you like doing those enough that you don't even want to give one up.

For example, my primary income right now comes from my teaching jobs. I don't have private students, I teach acting classes. I also work as a music copyist for a composer, as well as freelance for singers. I'm also a songwriter and playwright, but that's not bringing in any money right now. I'm also running a small theatre company in NYC, which isn't bringing in any money for me, either. The latter two are things I do because I love it and I hope that they will eventually bring me some income. But I also LOVE teaching, and don't plan on stopping.

So, you don't have to choose just one, and in this kind of business, you'll do better by not choosing, and making money wherever you can.

I plan to always have a church job to support me, and as a relatively experienced organist, and the fact that there is ALWAYS a shortage of organists, I am pretty much guaranteed to have a steady organ job all my life.

That's what you have to do - find your steady back-up job. Most composers (after getting countless degrees, mind you) teach at a university level. Usually they teach theory, counterpoint, orchestration, or some just do composition lessons and masterclasses. But I don't plan to teach, so the organ thing is pretty much my only choice.

Once you find a way to have a steady income like a church job, freelance jobs, a position in an orchestra (good for you instrumentalists), etc., you can live AND compose at the same time!

Of course, marrying someone who has money or is willing to support you and your passion would always help. ;)

I like to teach piano, but it's not what I love doing. I really enjoy it, although my first student thought i was really mad at her and started crying on our first lesson :blush: it's still fun.

I just don't think (right now) that I will be a good teacher because when I try to teach people those type of things it end up getting all jumbled up and confuses me and everyone else :P

I am good at teaching piano though because you basically just have to give them the proper technique and then help them on what they are doing wrong, I know what to listen for (because the songs they are playing are really basic..) so I can easily help them.

I didn't really realize that I should have something to fall back on, and I know that there is probably always going to be a shortage of bassoons (e.g. for the All-State band there were 158 alto saxes and 214 flutes and 104 clarinets that auditioned, and only 6 bassoons XD) so getting into the number of small bands (like the Derby Dinner Theater) shouldn't be too much of a problem, and I'm okay at improv soo I could also maybe get a few jazz gigs around town (that's what my old saxophone teacher did before he got a job on a cruise ship)

enter competitions and get your self known. There are call for scores and competitions out there for young composers every where all the time. If you are serious major in composition in college or better yet film scoring. Also make your talents available to people. Churches, small businesses, and any one who would need music could use your talents. There is a lot of options for composers but they are very hard to get unless you are aggressive, talented, and have a very good work ethic.

enter competitions and get your self known. There are call for scores and competitions out there for young composers every where all the time. If you are serious major in composition in college or better yet film scoring. Also make your talents available to people. Churches, small businesses, and any one who would need music could use your talents. There is a lot of options for composers but they are very hard to get unless you are aggressive, talented, and have a very good work ethic.

Best advice I've seen so far. Follow it...all of it ;). The part at the end is probably the most important if you want to be successful.

Best advice I've seen so far. Follow it...all of it ;). The part at the end is probably the most important if you want to be successful.

yeah, I copied and pasted it and printed it out so I could read it without having to click a million times to find it :P

aside from that, where could i find competitions, other than those already on YC? meh, I guess i'll do some research for myself :P

and how am I to tell people I can write for their Church and whatnot? It's not like I can go around town stapling papers to stop signs and wooden posts saying "Young Composer available!" lol.... or.... could i? <.<

I think the best way to get exposed in today's world is to set up a website, one that looks professional and has all your music on it. That way, it's easy to just hand out business cards with your website address on it and people can instantly know everything they need to know.

I think the best way to get exposed in today's world is to set up a website, one that looks professional and has all your music on it. That way, it's easy to just hand out business cards with your website address on it and people can instantly know everything they need to know.

Hmmmmmmm......

That is a REALLY good idea, and I'm sorta in "website making mode" after making most all the logos and helping my dad make a website for the high school band... so I might give that a try.

As for competitions, I ofund out that the "Grawemeyer Award" (if anyone has heard of it) is actually given away by the University of Louisville... which is the city i live in and is about 20 mins away from my house!

pretty schnazzy =P

EDIT: but i wouldn't win or anything 'cause it's an international thing, but it's cool that my hometown college is the one that gives it away

Ask around. Talk to people. Search the internet.

I think the best way to get exposed in today's world is to set up a website, one that looks professional and has all your music on it. That way, it's easy to just hand out business cards with your website address on it and people can instantly know everything they need to know.

Websites are cheap...business cards are cheaper.

Win-win situation.

The trouble is finding people to give the damn things to...

My advice is get good, REAL good, at what ever you plan to do. AND let everyone know what it is that you do. Talk, yell, sing, hand out signs, and talk some more. (how else will people know who you are.)

The trouble is finding people to give the damn things to...

Thats where drivng down main street throwing them out the windows (or off you bike) comes in handy...

considering you don't get caught and fined for littering... <_<...

I don't know. If I was a concert manager I wouldn't walk down the streets picking up every paper I find to discover new composers :P

You could always play in the NYC Subways as a fallback. With 600,000 people passing by you every day, and only 1% taking your card or throwing you a dollar, that's $6,000 in one day! Perhaps busking has it's merits!