Waltz in A minor "Chromatic"

Hi,

This is my first composition I have written as well as the first I have posted here. It is a waltz in A minor scale ABCBAending form. The MIDI audio file isn't great (no expression) and I was not able to attach them here for some reason, but if anyone wanted to try to play it on the piano, here are some tips:

• 
  play the chromatic scales in a very expressive "Chopin" style
  play the B section sort of a call and echo (hard to explain)
  play the ending increasingly slowly and reflectively
  

Any feedback would be great!

Chromatic Waltz in A minor.MUS

Thanks,

Pianoforte

PDF Score and mp3!

Good job, especially for a first composition!

Here are my critiques, and remember, this is just me over analyzing it. Also this is just my opinion.

First off, the tempo is dragging a little which makes it a little boring. While waltzes have slower tempos usually, yours may have benefited with a faster tempo. (e.g. Vivace = 180)

A second note would be that it is a little short. I know it is your first piece, but having a little bit more time to expand on the chromatic idea (which I like) would help this piece a lot. This is not to say that all pieces must be long, but this piece needs a bit more to support the basic idea.

I personally didn't get this piece, in the sense of where it was going. Usually I would expect a beginning (like the one you have) but then a middle section that leads to a climax. Only after that would the song return to the first theme. Your song stayed on the same level the whole time. This made it somewhat bland, in my opinion.

Also your sections (A,B,C etc.) are lacking. They are to short themselves and there is not much distinguishing between them; although I did notice the change to C major. Here is a basic scheme of what each section should bring to the song:

(This is not how they always must be, but this is a basic idea)

A - Opening, try to give the idea of the piece have three to five (or more) different melodies; make sure this is 'juicy' and will draw the listener in.

B - Begin to Build the action. Maybe change the key, make the texture more complicated, use quicker sharper melodies, louder dynamics, bigger chords, or anything else you can think of.

C - Climax. This section should be big and loud; or something of the sort. This is the whole point to the piece, even if it is not big and loud, it should still communicate whatever emotion is intended. At the end of this section there should be the resolution, I know it probably sounds weird to have the resolution in the middle but a perfect cadence at the end of this section could really help.

Lastly, Your melodies could be a little bit more melodic. I see where you were going, but there was too much repetition; too many measures repeating ababab. Try breaking up the melody more with different rhythms, you did this in some places like the end when you added the sixteenth notes.

To expand on everything I just I told you I suggest you listen to "Chopin prelude - Raindrop". You will be able to hear the ABA form clearly, listen to all the melodies in each section. Also note the climax early in the B section. Also I recommend you look up sonata form, wikipedia actually has a good article about it, I think it will benefit you a lot. Another website to check out is 8notes, they have a very good music theory program and its all free!

Very good! This is all constructive stuff that I hope benefits you (It had better, it took me like an hour to write this). You can be a really good composer if you keep at it!:thumbsup:

Pianoforte: It was nice and it was brought in and out rather nicely. It seemed a tad repetitive though, and some of your harmonic changes were a bit funny-sounding (although maybe that's just me).

Excellent Piece!

Welcome to YC!

Nice job :)

Edgar

Tokke: I don't know about mp3 but there's the midi...

Chromatic Waltz in A minor.mid

ChromaticWaltzThing.pdf

Thank you all for the suggestions and encouragement. I will update the waltz with your suggestions in mind and post it again. It will be loads better!

Also, how did you create the MIDI and PDF files?

Pianoforte

does anyone think the left hand needs to be elaborated some, and if so how should I go about doing that?

Piano: Are you sure it's not "flautist"?

Anyway, to make a midi file you just go to "Save As", then not as a "Finale Music File" but as a "Standard Midi File". To make a pdf, go to "Print", then click "Preview" in the box that appears. Save the pdf preview to your desktop or whatever.

Maybe towards the middle you could add to the building climax with the left hand, maybe using these techniques:

-Repeated notes (maybe chromatic or somewhat dissonant in their nature)

-Not only using the standard left hand format in waltzes (low-high-high, low-high-high) but maybe using more elaborate patterns (e.g. low-high-low, high-low-high), that one creates more instability because it insinuates 2/4 while still in 3/4.

Another example: low-high-high,high-high-high. The possibilities are numerous!

-Sudden absence of the left hand would be interesting, possibly creating an unstable or syncopated rhythm of rests and notes.

-More sudden dynamics (e.g. ff, pp, etc.)

Hope this helped, and best of luck! :)

Edgar

Edgar,

It can be either flutist or flautist (unless that has changed without my knowlege) it is more of a personal preference than anything.

Thank you for the suggestions, I hadn't thought about the left hand.

Pianoforte

:blink:

You were the one who mentioned the left hand...

Oops:blush:,

Well thanks for the suggestions...

:P

No problem.

EDIT: You're thirteen?

Wow. That's really good for thirteen...

'Nudder Edit: I'm going to post a score with some changes and suggestions; I have a few.

Yet 'Nudder Edit: Actually I'll just post them here.

Hey,

I was thinking about making this an ABA form and doing the B section in 2/4 time. Would it be best to just change the left hand to emphasize every other beat, or actually change the time signature? Also, Nick C recomended doing a climactic B section, but I was thinking of something more slow and reflective, then speeding back up to the A section, maybe taking out the half notes and using 16th or 8th notes in there place, giving it a very fast, whirling sound.

Does that sound like it might work? :hmmm:

Pianoforte

2/4? Weird. I would do a slow and reflective Sarabande (look it up in Wikipedia if you need to) style B section in say F major or C major, but the choice is yours.

Ok, I did say I had comments...

Mm. 1-4: The first note of M. 2 (B) does not work against the A in the bass. I would change that to a D, change the C to an A, and the D to an F, therefore raising the phrase a third. This F also works really well with the D minor chord in the bass; it asserts (with the minor third of D-F) the minorness (lack of a better word :P) of this new key. In M. 3, that last note should not be an A. You already used A to get to the key change in M. 2. You should change that A to a D because the C before the A in question leads to D naturally. Also, in the last key change, you got to the main note (the half note) from lower notes (you went up to it), so here for contrast you should go to that note (G) from higher notes. So it would be M. 3 ending with a D, to

M. 4: B,A,G (G is the resolving tone here). I hope you understood that, because there's a bit more...

M. 8: A in the right hand with a G major chord in the left??? Why not try D minor in the bass, preserving the A in the right hand? Or you could spice it up and go for E Major (or Emaj7) in the bass and changing that A to a G# or a B. Since you go back to A minor anyway in the next measure, this would be a dramatic little flourish and would work nicely. So basically the two I just stated are these: IV-I or V-I. It's deceptively simple :P. NOTE: for future reference, if you want to get from C major back to A minor: C,G,Emaj(7), then A. It's a fail-proof progression.

M. 10: Using the A and the B like that is a bit weird, but it creates an interesting color (using that B natural implies D Dorian, which is a mode, and modes have a very unsettling sound.) . You might want want to revise it or you might not. Alternatively, you could flatten the B, which would imply a more permanent modulation- to D minor.

M. 18: Very small suggestion. Possibly make that E a G instead.

M. 15-20: Play around more with those chromatic runs. e.g. start a run then suddenly go back to your other theme, or vice versa. There are numerous possibilities for developing this. Hint- Maybe do some chromatic runs in the BASS! :w00t: That'll get blood flowing, especially during climaxes!

Since the rest is largely the same (you should variate and modulate more), those are my main suggestions. I eagerly anticipate the update!

Spectatular job! :)

Best of luck,

Edgar

Here is an update of what i'm thinking. Simple ABA (if I think of a C part it will be ABCBA.) I have attached a basic ABA form (remember, I am going to elaborate alot on what I have here, this is just an outline. I will change accompaniment, add more complex rythm, add supporting melodies, etc. etc.) I just wanted to give you all an idea of where I'm going with this.:cool:

Enjoy

Chromatic Waltz in A minor.MID (outline).MID

Chromatic Waltz in A minor (outline).MUS

Many thanks

Pianoforte :thumbsup:

Great for a first work especially given your young age.

wow thats pretty awesome for a FIRST composition!

you dont have to follow rules. but since your waltz is super tonal and sorta Chopin-ish, i think you should have more dominant chords in your piece. i didnt even see one dominant chord in your piece. >.< (yes, im a very dominant dominated person.)

bar 7 or 17, for example, would be a really nice place to have a dominant chord doing into your tonic chord in the next bar.

i noticed you do have a middle section. but i dont think its enough to satisfy a climax-hungry listener like me. hehe.....

you should build up your theme more. cus its sorta repetitive right now.

you can also switch things up a bit, so that its more than just "right-hand-single-note-melody + left-hand-normal-accompaniment".

i also feel that you can make your ending stronger. you can either use a stronger cadence or.....i dont know, do something to make it BOOM.

but come to think of it.....lol, nothing i said is really NECESSARY, its just my opinion. :P

its nice to hear music from someone my own age. :D

:mellow:

It should be about a week until I finish the update...

Have you looked at the things I mentioned?

yes, i have.

i didn't change anything yet, but as i update i definitly will

micah

Cool. :cool:

Hey there!

For a first composition, that's pretty tight! I know a lot if twelve-fourteen composers whose music sounds like low budget video game music, but I have to say yours is above that kind of influence.

As I'm not a very experienced composer, and still young (as I mentioned earlier, I'm only fourteen) my advice may not be as sound as others, but as soon as I get onto a real computer instead of working off my iPod touch, I'll give your piece a listen. You too, Will Kirk, if you're reading this.

I'll try to havr something posted by tomorrow. :) sorry for the wait.

how long should I make each section (A,B,C...)

would a page per section be good?

:unsure:

Micah

Yes, a page would be good, the main thing to remember is to make sure there is some sort of shift to make it clear to the listener.

Also, Nick C recommended doing a climactic B section, but I was thinking of something more slow and reflective, then speeding back up to the A section

You could do a slower middle section, but if you do, it needs to be going somewhere. Right now your piece just kind of 'goes' until the end. Even if the middle section is slower and reflective, it still needs a climax. Not necessarily a big flashy climax, but a climax none the less. I again recommend you listen to Chopin's prelude "Raindrop"; it is a good example of this. It keeps the same tempo and even is more somber, but it still reaches the climax.

Also if you are going to do a slower middle section, I recommend you play the rest of the piece faster.

Again these are just suggestions, I really am in no place to tell you exactly how to make a song. This is actually very good, especially for a first composition; it actually reminds me of my own first few compositions. (Now I'm getting all nostalgic) Really though keep it up, you could be very good one day :D

OK,

also, would it be a good idea to change the key from a minor (A section) to a major (B), or would it be best just to change to a different minor key?

:eyebrow:

Micah

I agree, it will give it more variety. Although I did notice the switch to C Major somewhere in there, however it was too brief. =)

Umm, any key would be fine I guess. I would suggest E minor (the dominant minor) or any major key. It is really up to you, just pick the one that works the best with this piece.

Any other suggestions or comments?