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My first competition piece and first score. I stayed on a specific point and re used motives for the first time. Would love to hear what you think

(also, I really appreciate the member voting, thank you so much!)

Edited by Left Unexplained
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Wow do I love this piece.

Your writing is very idiomatic, it absolutely portrays your story well. Ya I know the score is dodgy, but I'm assuming you used a sequencer. I think from now on I'm going to take that approach, I started in Sibelius and imported to DAW, but I had a hell of a time trying to get it right. 

I'd say my favorite parts were the solo piano sections, spicy rhythms. It was tough to follow the score in spots, make sure all of that is playable! I really loved the harp theme afterwards too. In general I like the collage approach you took with how it progressed, it's always refreshing to hear novelty in form. I felt like it could of used a bit more development, with how abundant the ideas were, but you blended your themes well enough it's only nit picky to me.

I've noticed a stronger influence with video game music and classical/concert styles among the music I've heard from here lately. I honestly love that trend, do you draw inspiration game music? I lot of the timbre had a final fantasy vibe to it. Your mixing is great too, I'm sure you'll hear me bugging you for advice with it in the future. 

Thanks for sharing, you were my vote to win 😄

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This was also my no. 1 pick.  I love the awe-inspiring sounds you create in this and the form keeps things always fresh.  Makes me want to write in a more through-composed fashion then I have hitherto done.  The lines you wrote for the celesta are quite wonderful/magical sounding.  I can just imagine a slow motion-picture of the fledgling struggling to achieve flight.  Did you come up with the title as you were composing the music or maybe before or after it?  Just curious.  Nice job and congratulations on 2nd place!

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Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, Undoubtedly Strange said:

Great work! One thing I would change with the score would be to, during the piano solo, leave out the other parts to make it easier for people to keep up. I had to scroll like crazy lol.

Which software did you use to make this?

 

Logic, eastwest hollywood orchestra

Edited by Left Unexplained
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21 hours ago, Thatguy v2.0 said:

Wow do I love this piece.

Your writing is very idiomatic, it absolutely portrays your story well. Ya I know the score is dodgy, but I'm assuming you used a sequencer. I think from now on I'm going to take that approach, I started in Sibelius and imported to DAW, but I had a hell of a time trying to get it right. 

I'd say my favorite parts were the solo piano sections, spicy rhythms. It was tough to follow the score in spots, make sure all of that is playable! I really loved the harp theme afterwards too. In general I like the collage approach you took with how it progressed, it's always refreshing to hear novelty in form. I felt like it could of used a bit more development, with how abundant the ideas were, but you blended your themes well enough it's only nit picky to me.

I've noticed a stronger influence with video game music and classical/concert styles among the music I've heard from here lately. I honestly love that trend, do you draw inspiration game music? I lot of the timbre had a final fantasy vibe to it. Your mixing is great too, I'm sure you'll hear me bugging you for advice with it in the future. 

Thanks for sharing, you were my vote to win 😄

 

I like skyrim's music a lot but I don't really play video games that much. I'm inspired by film music but also late romantic composers, and also I want to do something new so part of it is just being influenced by my own passions and feelings. Thank you man, I really enjoyed your piece too, very very complex.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, PaperComposer said:

This was also my no. 1 pick.  I love the awe-inspiring sounds you create in this and the form keeps things always fresh.  Makes me want to write in a more through-composed fashion then I have hitherto done.  The lines you wrote for the celesta are quite wonderful/magical sounding.  I can just imagine a slow motion-picture of the fledgling struggling to achieve flight.  Did you come up with the title as you were composing the music or maybe before or after it?  Just curious.  Nice job and congratulations on 2nd place!

I wouldn't say it was planned all the way through but I was thinking of the planet earth bit where the little birds have to jump out of a high nest and bounce on the ground (and are okay) and just what it sounded like to me. I don't usually start with any plan, I do it and then I start to see the meaning behind it, and then the rest of my piece is the rest of the story where now I have creative control.

What do you mean by "through-composed" jw?

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2 minutes ago, Left Unexplained said:

What do you mean by "through-composed" jw?

Through-composed meaning without relying too much on repetition (although sometimes there may be hidden variations on the original material).  Like the piece for piano and orchestra "Africa" by Saint-Seans which I thought of when I listened to your music.

Africa

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1 minute ago, PaperComposer said:

Through-composed meaning without relying too much on repetition (although sometimes there may be hidden variations on the original material).  Like the piece for piano and orchestra "Africa" by Saint-Seans which I thought of when I listened to your music.

Africa

 

Oh ok yeah. Thanks! I used a lot of hidden variations on the piano solo

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Very nice! I definitely get a very impressionist feel, with influences of Debussy and Ravel. I can also clearly see the program play out through the music, from the fledgling awkwardly stumbling during the piano solo to gracefully soaring over the horizon at the conclusion.

While you used a lot of interesting textures from an orchestration standpoint, I felt like there were a few missed opportunities. As an example in m.54, as the flute begins it's second phrase the orchestration stays more or less the same. A thought that immediately pops into my head is to have the lower woodwinds (clarinets and bassoons) come in here quietly with chords to add an extra tonal dimension to the new harmonies we are hearing. In the bigger picture, I thought the ensemble in general was underutilized, and I don't believe there is ever a true "tutti" moment, which I think might highlight the climax a little better.

I also think there are a few practical things to consider in your part writing. For example the horns are playing some quite difficult arpeggio figures continuously from m.75 all the way through m.90 with nowhere to breathe. And I think the trumpets playing the octave figures starting at m.83 would completely dominate the rest of the ensemble. You've also got some very dense chords in the 2nd violins around m.58, with as many as 7 notes. If you've only got 12 or so second violin players, you'll only have 2 players on each note - just mentioning in case this wasn't the sound you were going for.

Lastly, the score...well... let's just say it could use a little work 😂. It's awesome that you put one together for this, and as you can see you get better feedback when you do. I would spend some time figuring out how to get whatever notation program you use to make a better looking score. 

Overall well done, and congratulations once again on your competition performance. It's good to see a completed work by you on here, and I look forward to more. 

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36 minutes ago, gmm said:

While you used a lot of interesting textures from an orchestration standpoint, I felt like there were a few missed opportunities. As an example in m.54, as the flute begins it's second phrase the orchestration stays more or less the same. A thought that immediately pops into my head is to have the lower woodwinds (clarinets and bassoons) come in here quietly with chords to add an extra tonal dimension to the new harmonies we are hearing. In the bigger picture, I thought the ensemble in general was underutilized, and I don't believe there is ever a true "tutti" moment, which I think might highlight the climax a little better.

interesting. I haven't studied orchestration at all, I bought rimisky korsakovs book on it but it was too advanced for me plus it got ruined. Do you have any idea how one might improve at that, how did you get to this point? jw

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44 minutes ago, gmm said:

I also think there are a few practical things to consider in your part writing. For example the horns are playing some quite difficult arpeggio figures continuously from m.75 all the way through m.90 with nowhere to breathe. And I think the trumpets playing the octave figures starting at m.83 would completely dominate the rest of the ensemble. You've also got some very dense chords in the 2nd violins around m.58, with as many as 7 notes. If you've only got 12 or so second violin players, you'll only have 2 players on each note - just mentioning in case this wasn't the sound you were going for.

yeah I don't think about anything like that yet. I'm going to start adding analyzing scores of works I like to my practice load. I just write literally each note into Logic without ever thinking about divisi (had to look that up) or orchestration or anything, I don't double anything I'm coming from a place of ear and novice romanticism (which, btw, I dont want to lose). I'm literally coming from a place of some random person with no training being like "I wanna make film scores" and then trying to do it. I don't know how everyone here learned the nomenclature of composers but I would love to know it too!

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56 minutes ago, Left Unexplained said:

interesting. I haven't studied orchestration at all, I bought rimisky korsakovs book on it but it was too advanced for me plus it got ruined. Do you have any idea how one might improve at that, how did you get to this point? jw

 

I wouldn't say I ever been properly "trained" either. Most of what I do is trying to emulate something I've heard before. The best resource is of course scores, which you can find for free for most classical composers on imslp.org. Since you've mentioned Debussy as an inspiration, here's a link to his page: https://imslp.org/wiki/Category:Debussy%2C_Claude. Also, listen to as much music as you can, and when you find something you really like, get your hands on the score and study it like crazy to figure out how it works.

From a technique standpoint, I guess I tend to think of music in layers, like melody, countermelody, accompaniment, chords, bass etc. Try to break you're music down into these layers, and experiment with using each instrument in the different layers. When you study scores, try to analyze them in this manner as well by imagining what layer the composer intended for them.

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53 minutes ago, Left Unexplained said:

I'm coming from a place of ear and novice romanticism (which, btw, I dont want to lose).

I don't think you ever will, your instincts and tastes never go away. If you're afraid that learning the more technical aspects of music and composition will hinder your creativity I'll challenge you to do this: Find one person who learned music theory or harmony or counterpoint or anything like that who truly believes it set them backwards in their creativity. I've never met anyone who said learning music theory made them a worse composer, but I've met plenty who said they resisted for the longest time and when they finally did, they wished they'd learned it sooner. Anyone who says otherwise is either lying or doesn't know what they're talking about. Since when has anyone ever hurt themselves by learning something?

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On 9/1/2020 at 12:17 AM, gmm said:

I wouldn't say I ever been properly "trained" either. Most of what I do is trying to emulate something I've heard before. The best resource is of course scores, which you can find for free for most classical composers on imslp.org. Since you've mentioned Debussy as an inspiration, here's a link to his page: https://imslp.org/wiki/Category:Debussy%2C_Claude. Also, listen to as much music as you can, and when you find something you really like, get your hands on the score and study it like crazy to figure out how it works.

From a technique standpoint, I guess I tend to think of music in layers, like melody, countermelody, accompaniment, chords, bass etc. Try to break you're music down into these layers, and experiment with using each instrument in the different layers. When you study scores, try to analyze them in this manner as well by imagining what layer the composer intended for them.

 

thank you for the resources!

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On 9/1/2020 at 12:26 AM, gmm said:

I don't think you ever will, your instincts and tastes never go away. If you're afraid that learning the more technical aspects of music and composition will hinder your creativity I'll challenge you to do this: Find one person who learned music theory or harmony or counterpoint or anything like that who truly believes it set them backwards in their creativity. I've never met anyone who said learning music theory made them a worse composer, but I've met plenty who said they resisted for the longest time and when they finally did, they wished they'd learned it sooner. Anyone who says otherwise is either lying or doesn't know what they're talking about. Since when has anyone ever hurt themselves by learning something?

 

Just like I have learned in buddhism to trust teachers I should accept that here as well, you are further on the path than me and you think that so I trust you

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