Time Symphony Op.10 Complete

I realized that we,the humble human beings ,are unable to decide which moment to last longer,and which moment to pass very quickly ! So this cause the emerge of a philosophy!

The romantics ,the post romantics ( especially in poetry ), revolted against the time with a terrible desire; desire that I tried to express in the symphony ( especially the 1st movement that can be named "The Riot") !

The 1st movement I finished it in almost 3 weeks and it represents the childish struggle to fight against the time...

The 2nd movement is constructed especially on the human side, his misery and his agony and of course the hope are the main characteristics of the piece (this movement can be also named "The sufferance..."

The 3rd movement is a huge ciorba ( Ciorb? - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) ;) . It is, as some noticed, a field in which I've tested my weapons, if you allow my analogy ;). I enjoyed a lot composing it, and I'm not ashamed of it (even though I have a lot of reason to be so). As in the previous movements, there are certain orchestral issues that must be revised (and not orchestral only)! It will be done... as soon as possible (but that can mean several months).

I dare now :D, on the 13th of October 2008, to upload the (abandoned) project of the 4th movement, called "The Exile". I do this, because several professors advised me to continue it... being surprised by this project... Personally, I'm a little spooked by its quintessence... It was composed in several days, as a personal ambition (after listening one of the latest compositions of Aurel Stroe, God rest his soul), to try to compose music using clusters and a more modern musical idiom... This was happening in the summer of 2007, after finishing the 3rd movement, in June, same year. About the score for this project... It's just a sketch, made in Finale... I didn't know the modern notation back then, so every sound you hear is there, graphically... So the score is a real stigmatism!

To LISTEN or DOWNLOAD:

mp3

Putfile - Androne Sebastian TIME SYMPHONY First Movement Op10

Putfile - Androne Sebastian TIME SYMPHONY Second Movement Op10

Putfile - Time Symphony 3rd Mov

Time Symphony 4th - Project

Scores:

Time Symphony I - "The Riot"

Time Symphony II - "The Sufferance"

Time Symphony III - "The Odyssey of Time"

This work is interesting, more from what other can learn not to do in it, however.

Your orchestration is generally acceptable, but it is too heavy.

It is virtually the same all the way through with very little respite. It get a little bit tiring for the listener.

there are a few details I'd like to point out:

• mm21 the piccolo runs need to be doubled with flutes and other woodwinds
  
• mm43 (and again at mm131, mm227) the semitone shift is jarring and just feels gratuitous
  
• mm53 you would need to add more woodwinds over your pizz section
  
• while at mm102, you would need to lighten the texture
  
• mm113, well, I just find this part corny (esp. the chromatic run in the low brass)
  
• through-out you need to stop thinking of your woodwinds in pairs that way

generally speaking, you are treating the woodwinds as static pairs - 2 flutes, 2 oboes, 2 clarinets, 2 bassoons, and they are staying put in the same register through-out, no matter what the music is actually doing.

There are lots of places you should have doubled melodies in octaves, with for example both flutes in unison with a clarinet, or flutes in octaves with clarinets in octaves unison with flutes.

What comes through the most is that the clarinets are in their mellowest register through-out the piece, even in the fortissimo passages.

Stop treating the piccolo as a solo instrument. It only plays a few measures WITH any other instruments, you seem to give it constant melodic material of its own that has absolutely no doubling elsewhere. This is going to sound rather "naked".

So basically, this piece doesn't feel so much orchestrated as it does "full orchestra non-stop".

Another thing, you think of instruments as being "in a register" and work in accordance to that. This isn't always the case. For example, that descending passage at the very end, of two 8th notes that jump from instrument to instrument... you have the woodwinds start it out, singly, then at the bottom the brass come in. This is just jarring. The sudden change in timbre will not work at all. I'd recommend instead that you work on assigning those 8th notes to woodwinds in groups, with an accent on the first to a brass instrument, go down the phrase, repeating the same groupings, only changing groupings as the notes fall outside of any instruments' playable ranges.

The music is a little "top heavy" as well. Most, if not all, of the melodic material is in a rather extreme high register. It is also a bit TOO full and rich all the time. A steady diet of whipped cream and chocolate, while nice in fantasy, just won't satisfy you for long.

musically, I find the sudden stops in the music too disruptive. While psychologically the idea might work, musically you could achieve the same effect without actually HAVING any silence: a held note in a few instruments, or a sudden shift in timbre. Remember that just because YOU hear an instrument playing, even if it's a long held note, the audience will not necessarily perceive it as "thematic, and will associate it with a "stop".

That being said, harmonically, the piece seems too static to me. I don't get a clear sense of it going from "harmonic point A" to "harmonic point B". However, your next piece will certainly be better still.

I definately get a sense that you are working from what you hear while you compose, rather than from what you know. You need to start working from your score now and looking at it to see where there are densities and textures that will not work.

Thank you for your instructive comment... I think....

Do I have anything good in this piece?

I would say the part between 3.30 - 4.30 is rather interesting. But the rest... I think you shouldn't try to imply a complete finished "feeling" in almost every note. In my opinion music should be a bit more like a journey or a another metafor with the same content. you get the idea i hope. You give away all the ideas immediatly. Try to work towards a certain climax more.. This is realy more my taste than a musicaltheoratical idea. But i think it would do your piece well.

Gijs

Trying to grapple with Time is a concept that has been done fairly effectively by several 20th century composers. Three pieces in particular stand out for me, Rihm's 'Time Chant', Birtwistle's 'The Triumph of Time', and Kabel

Thank you Matusleo for your time spent analyzing my piece... :)

I hoped ,when I posted my piece here, that someone would approach the theme(that is The Time...) And for this I have to thank you again;it is a very heavy subject indeed and I hope that you understood what I wanted to show in this first part of a symphony!

The introduction has a very nice theme (that is at the contrabass -exactly at the beginning) that is repeated by the clarinet... But you are right!

"Ideas come in the first couple minutes so quickly and then disappear that the audience can scarcely keep track of them."

Yes I know... I had an unusually "distribution" of the themes,yet... when I have an idea is very hard for me to change my mind :blush:

The most important thing that I want to say is the role of the "humorous segment":

If the beginning shows us the sufferance of the humble man (and the same mood repeated in other sections of the piece),the "humorous segment" describes the attitude of Time :indifference,arrogance and the mocking...

I fallowed Qccowboys advice .... and I doubled some instruments in the woodwind section! I've distributed the flute (especially the flute) with the solo parts of the Piccolo... But I can not change the structure... I want to learn from my mistakes... And maybe,after some good years,I will laugh watching the scores of Time Symphony Op.10 like (maybe) some of you do :( !

P.S. Sorry for the question... but what does "disjointedness" means? :blush: I haven't found it in the dictionary...

In this movement I chose to respect the traditional Adagio... The piece gravitates around the introduction theme of the first movement. It starts in G minor ,and then passes in to D minor -the tonality of the piece. I want to mention that I added a string quartet with the role of cadenza... The piece actually has 3 themes (they are not quite theme... you can call them "mini-themes";the description gave it Donya Quick from www.midi-contest.com):

1. minute 0:48 -the French Horn;this is the theme from the first movement that in fact is the essence of the second one

2. minute 2:28 -all strings; before that, the string quartet introduces the theme.Theme that constitutes the character of the piece.

3. minute 3:17 -the strings,the bassoons and the English Horn present the third theme that is in contrast with the other two.

I hope that I've made myself understood;if not please post your questions!

I can't post right now the MUS file,and the midi has some channel errors;please listen the mp3!

mp3

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SoundClick song info: Time Symphony 2nd Movement Op10 by Androne Sebastian - Song info page with free MP3 music downloads

I've posted the MUS file in the first post along with the First Movement!

Hi, your piece is really nice, very well orchestrated and crafted. Being an amateur composer, I really can give you any detailed criticism. But overall, I really enjoyed this piece, great work.

Just wondering, if this is Op.10, you must have other pieces that ranges from op.1 - 9, correct?

Thank you for listening! :) Not all the Opuses are finished.;)

could you post a score of the second movement?

I've just uploaded the MUS file. Please gentlemen ,be my guests ! :laugh:

Hey,

I really enjoyed your piece, though it was a bit disjointed. I'm curious as to the sound samples you use to record... it sounds very life-like. Is it GPO or something else? Thanks.

Is it GPO or something else?

Yes. It's GPO and some other programs (the Tuba,the Horns ,the Solo Violin etc. are sampled with these programs);)

It's very nice indeed :P It's nicely orchestrated, for an amateur composer :D (I am an amateur composer myself). And it sounds post romantic, rather than modern. Or in the style of Moyzes, if you've heard of him ( Alexander Moyzes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ), although he was more "romantic" in terms of form and orchestration.

What's more, if I were you, I would call the work a "Concerto For Orchestra" more than a Symphony, because, although it has a symphonic texture, there are points where an instrument takes up a small solo, then another instrument takes up another solo, then maybe the string ensemble takes up a solo and stuff. And maybe use the name and do something different in terms of texture, to lighten it up a bit (it does sound a bit heavy, as Qccowboy mentioned) and have special parts where solo instruments can be shown, or something else that you might have in mind ;)

It's very nice indeed :P It's nicely orchestrated, for an amateur composer :D (I am an amateur composer myself). And it sounds post romantic, rather than modern. Or in the style of Moyzes, if you've heard of him ( Alexander Moyzes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ), although he was more "romantic" in terms of form and orchestration.

What's more, if I were you, I would call the work a "Concerto For Orchestra" more than a Symphony, because, although it has a symphonic texture, there are points where an instrument takes up a small solo, then another instrument takes up another solo, then maybe the string ensemble takes up a solo and stuff. And maybe use the name and do something different in terms of texture, to lighten it up a bit (it does sound a bit heavy, as Qccowboy mentioned) and have special parts where solo instruments can be shown, or something else that you might have in mind ;)

Thanks for your answer! About the orchestration... I wanted to be heavy;the First Movement describes the outrage of the human being; and I know that some times may look monotonous but with a flexible orchestra this disadvantage can be overcome! The second movement focuses especially on the Man , and the 3rd movement (that I've just started) will describe the Time! The 4th movement will be a BIG surprise!

if I were you, I would call the work a "Concerto For Orchestra" more than a Symphony

I can't do that :D ! But thanks for giving your opinion!

There is no one to give me some feedback for The Second Movement?

Please! :toothygrin:

Can you post the scores for Finale 2006, please?

Your is too much new version of Finale and I cannot read your score.

Thanks.

Unfortunately I can't :( . Maybe next week I will try to find someone to transport this MUS file from Finale 2007 to Finale 2006!

yes I cannot access the second movement either. I did enjoy your first movement very much though. It is big and bold and very brightly coloured and full of eastern europeanness, (that violin solo for example!) you are romanian arent you? This shines through again and again: the orchestration is heavy yes and I can see why you want it this way: tumultuous and very romantic . . . . passionate and honest yes?

yes I cannot access the second movement either. I did enjoy your first movement very much though. It is big and bold and very brightly coloured and full of eastern europeanness, (that violin solo for example!) you are romanian arent you? This shines through again and again: the orchestration is heavy yes and I can see why you want it this way: tumultuous and very romantic . . . . passionate and honest yes?

Thank you very much for listening my piece!Yes I am Romanian and Yes I wanted that the piece should be tumultuous and very romantic;passionate and honest!

I compose only to express my inner self! I didn't do this for the money or for a contest! I know that I have much to learn! I've started the harmony 3-4 month ago! So it's a long road for becoming a composer! But I hardly wait!

I've just finished the 3rd movement of my first symphony! I've uploaded the mp3 and the mid. file in the front page! This movement is the last, I just can't and don't want to see another finish to this work... The 3rd movement has 19 minutes and 900 measures... I tried to express my personal impression about the time! It has a lots of influences and I used some very nice modes that I let you to discover!

Thank you!

Can anyone give me an opinion, an advice some feedback for the 3rd movement? Please... :evil:

PS The 2nd movement also... please...

This work is interesting, more from what other can learn not to do in it, however.

Your orchestration is generally acceptable, but it is too heavy.

It is virtually the same all the way through with very little respite. It get a little bit tiring for the listener.

there are a few details I'd like to point out:

• mm21 the piccolo runs need to be doubled with flutes and other woodwinds
  
• mm43 (and again at mm131, mm227) the semitone shift is jarring and just feels gratuitous
  
• mm53 you would need to add more woodwinds over your pizz section
  
• while at mm102, you would need to lighten the texture
  
• mm113, well, I just find this part corny (esp. the chromatic run in the low brass)
  
• through-out you need to stop thinking of your woodwinds in pairs that way

generally speaking, you are treating the woodwinds as static pairs - 2 flutes, 2 oboes, 2 clarinets, 2 bassoons, and they are staying put in the same register through-out, no matter what the music is actually doing.

There are lots of places you should have doubled melodies in octaves, with for example both flutes in unison with a clarinet, or flutes in octaves with clarinets in octaves unison with flutes.

What comes through the most is that the clarinets are in their mellowest register through-out the piece, even in the fortissimo passages.

Stop treating the piccolo as a solo instrument. It only plays a few measures WITH any other instruments, you seem to give it constant melodic material of its own that has absolutely no doubling elsewhere. This is going to sound rather "naked".

So basically, this piece doesn't feel so much orchestrated as it does "full orchestra non-stop".

Another thing, you think of instruments as being "in a register" and work in accordance to that. This isn't always the case. For example, that descending passage at the very end, of two 8th notes that jump from instrument to instrument... you have the woodwinds start it out, singly, then at the bottom the brass come in. This is just jarring. The sudden change in timbre will not work at all. I'd recommend instead that you work on assigning those 8th notes to woodwinds in groups, with an accent on the first to a brass instrument, go down the phrase, repeating the same groupings, only changing groupings as the notes fall outside of any instruments' playable ranges.

The music is a little "top heavy" as well. Most, if not all, of the melodic material is in a rather extreme high register. It is also a bit TOO full and rich all the time. A steady diet of whipped cream and chocolate, while nice in fantasy, just won't satisfy you for long.

musically, I find the sudden stops in the music too disruptive. While psychologically the idea might work, musically you could achieve the same effect without actually HAVING any silence: a held note in a few instruments, or a sudden shift in timbre. Remember that just because YOU hear an instrument playing, even if it's a long held note, the audience will not necessarily perceive it as "thematic, and will associate it with a "stop".

That being said, harmonically, the piece seems too static to me. I don't get a clear sense of it going from "harmonic point A" to "harmonic point B". However, your next piece will certainly be better still.

I definately get a sense that you are working from what you hear while you compose, rather than from what you know. You need to start working from your score now and looking at it to see where there are densities and textures that will not work.

I aggree with all that is stated here. :) good luck keep writing.

Thanks! But the review you quoted is for the first movement... The 3rd movement is the one of which I would like to receive a review.. :) and the second one...

Thanks! But the review you quoted is for the first movement... The 3rd movement is the one of which I would like to receive a review.. :) and the second one...

I've never seen you post outside your own works, this is a problem because people on YC tend to review pieces from people they know and respect. So I'd suggest to get a bit more social and go and participate in the Yc community. :blink: