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Hey there Matthew, Do you have a teacher? Or do you study music on your own with online course guidance? My opinion is do what you want, learn what interests you, but I think it's really advantageous to continue with tonal harmony. When you learn why tonality broke down, it helps with understanding the motives atonal music is trying to achieve. Also, post your music if you haven't already! That'll really help with your growth, as even strangers on the internet can provide a wealth of knowledge. Cheers buddy

https://www.noteflight.com/scores/view/71e5c9cb2af83e1b63286b8d3463d66cbc0d02fb Untitled (2).mid

Well I guess you have to be clear with what you wanna achieve, like harmonic, timberal, thematic, rhythmic fullness or whatever fullness haha. I guess if you work this way, you have tp achieve harmonic fullness in the SATB first, which is to allow all the tones of a chord whenever possible. Then when you arrange it to band, the orchestration matters for the timberal fullness. Henry

I’m a 16-year-old trying to become a composer, and I’m pretty much new to this forum! I really want to express myself in more modernist idioms, but I’m still developing my technique. Right now I’m working on a traditional harmony course, and I’m at the point of cadences and simple modulations. I’ve composed several tonal pieces, including a mazurka, a sonata movement, and a late-romantic waltz. I guess my question is whether I should compose many more “traditionally tonal” pieces before moving to the idioms that excite me more? If so, when is the point when I can move to non-functional harmony? Or can I just study traditional harmony on the side, but try to compose more modern-sounding music? I have already been doing this to a certain extent (my late-romantic waltz). Thanks for any suggestions! —Matthew

While don’t like to use too many labels, I would say I personally gravitate towards music that has a rich use of rather coloristic harmony, with a strong feel for natural resonance, strong formal logic and internal coherence, as well as a sense of direction. I think of music often in terms of space: my ideal music opens up spaces and dimensions that the listener may not have foreseen, while remaining colorful and somewhat transparent. My biggest inspirations musically are probably Messiaen, Beethoven, Wagner, Debussy, and Scriabin (not to mention Grisey, Saariaho, and late Boulez). Because of my interest in tonal space and acoustics, I like to utilize geometrical lattices of tonal space, and much of my musical understanding is shaped by them. I think that’s good advice: keep building technique, but also attempt to compose the music you want to compose on the side. I’m excited to undertake this journey of developing my personal voice, thanks for the encouragement! And I do tend to be quite critical of my own compositional attempts: but the great thing about posting for others to evaluate is they’ll provide constructive criticism, and real feedback for improvement. That’s something I can’t do on my own!

I'm withdrawing my participation. Competition or not, if you're putting on essentially a display of music created by members and also giving out site badges for them, then I feel that music should actually be created and produced by the members of the forum. I want my music alongside other human-created works. I'm sorry Mike, but you guys folded like a cheap suit in a matter of minutes. You give these AI bros an inch and they'll take 3 miles. What is to say you won't fold the same when it's not "just for fun?" Aren't all of these "just for fun" in some way? And people will bring up that "Well you accepted AI that time!" Is this a place for composers, or a place for grifters passing off AI music? I'm sorry Mike, but you guys folded like a cheap suit in a matter of minutes. You give these AI bros an inch and they'll take 3 miles. What is to say you won't fold the same when it's not "just for fun?" Aren't all of these "just for fun" in some way? And people will bring up that "Well you accepted AI that time!" Is this a place for composers, or a place for grifters passing off AI music? Also something else I need to say about this: So I, and others, can put in hours of work writing the music, orchestration, making detailed mockups, etc. but a guy who writes a Suno prompt and has a "piece" in 5 minutes is treated as equally-valid in this event? It isn't actually even his music. Where is the "fun" in that, exactly? Why even bother? You guys say you want more people to do reviews. What your reviews are going to become if this kind of thing is permitted is a bunch of people being like "Nice prompt bro, but I would've said 'romantic soaring strings' instead of 'cinematic'". Also something else I need to say about this: So I, and others, can put in hours of work writing the music, orchestration, making detailed mockups, etc. but a guy who writes a Suno prompt and has a "piece" in 5 minutes is treated as equally-valid in this event? It isn't actually even his music. Where is the "fun" in that, exactly? Why even bother? You guys say you want more people to do reviews. What your reviews are going to become if this kind of thing is permitted is a bunch of people being like "Nice prompt bro, but I would've said 'romantic soaring strings' instead of 'cinematic'". Yeah no; sorry if I'm a bit late, but if someone makes their song out of AI I agree that they should be disqualified, but I feel like withdrawing your participation is a bit too far. for me one of my my favorite parts about writing a piece is that you get to pick out the order that the notes go and to choose what notes go where. I feel like if you give an AI the key, mood, and length of the song but you don't make it your self, there's just not enough creativity. I too, have made an AI song and posted it on here, but that was just for fun, and it certainly wasn't for a competition. I also told the AI to give me the notes and I put them myself and that was just to see if AI could really make a song. I think it's fine, just this once but I do not think AI-made/assisted pieces should be allowed in competitions anymore.

Welcome to the forums, Mahler2009! I agree with my colleagues here dude. Get more into tonal harmony + whatever piques your interest. Keep composing, this is a discipline that's best learnt by practice, trial an error. Getting your own voice may be difficult but if you are resilient, disciplined and constant, you'll achieve it. Your first works may or may not hint you where you want to go. Be curious, experiment, come back, go forward. Feel free to share them with us, we won't go hard (not much, I hope 🥶) ! Best regards, Daniel–Ø.

Hello @mahler2009, Welcome to the forum! I couldn't agree more with @Thatguy v2.0. What is the idioms you want to express with? Henry

My general advice for those who want to learn the craft--and this will sound cliche--is to start at the beginning. This is known as theory. Most harmony books cover basics first(meter, intervals, etc). But I think, it is best to jump start on those topics by either learning an instrument or self-study. Each of their benefits. When I learned theory, it was through my piano lessons. Teachers either use Alfred or Faber or Faber. Both have theory work book. The theory workbook expands on lessons and provides exercise to train you. So let us say you were learning about 3/4 in a lesson. The theory book would go more in depth and other books that cover aspect of the lesson. The second option is self taught. Alfred has music theory book: Alfred's Essentials of Music Theory: A Complete Self-Study Course for All Musicians (Book & 2 CDs): Surmani, Andrew, Surmani, Karen Farnum, Manus, Morton: 0038081232973: Amazon.com: Books Getting ahead of start on this place you ahead of the class. You can probably skip the chapters on theory and go to next part...counterpoint.

Can you elaborate and define what you mean by "fullness"?

Hi Matthew. Here's my answer: It is easier to start with tonal harmony vs modern harmony. It is probably better start with tonal, traditional harmony so you can understand modern harmony change that.

Unfortunately, I was not able to join this round. The holiday season is busy for me: traveling to see family. However, what I can do, is review member compositions that are not related to the competition. That way, my reviewing activity help in other means. I want to 1:1 ratio for me. I hope others will follow my example. 🙂

Also something else I need to say about this: So I, and others, can put in hours of work writing the music, orchestration, making detailed mockups, etc. but a guy who writes a Suno prompt and has a "piece" in 5 minutes is treated as equally-valid in this event? It isn't actually even his music. Where is the "fun" in that, exactly? Why even bother? You guys say you want more people to do reviews. What your reviews are going to become if this kind of thing is permitted is a bunch of people being like "Nice prompt bro, but I would've said 'romantic soaring strings' instead of 'cinematic'".

I'm withdrawing my participation. Competition or not, if you're putting on essentially a display of music created by members and also giving out site badges for them, then I feel that music should actually be created and produced by the members of the forum. I want my music alongside other human-created works.

Hi long time for no posting! I decided to post an old work of mine.This Nocturne in C-sharp minor is a juvenile work of me as a 16 year old. I didn't think much at the time of composing, but I did write in the style of Chopin Nocturne then. And then a sudden thought caused me to have a 1st try in fugue in 2:35! I revised the work recently to improve on some voice leadings and transitions except passages after the fugato, but retained as much the original intention as I can as a 16 year old then. The work, even though as immature as it is, does reflect some of my feelings then. Here is the Youtube video and the score of the piece: (Final Draft) Nocturne in C sharp minor.pdf This work can be regarded as in a rondo structure: 0:00 1st part(A), typical Chopin Nocturne texture. Don't know why I modulated the music to F major but the music did so himself... 0:58 2nd part(B) Main melody in F major, but with a new b motive in b.31-32 1:35 3rd part (A') The main melody in the original key can't wait to enter... Gets more agitated and cools down. 2:35 4th part (B'). A fugato using motive b as subject and main melody as episode, modulates once more to F major 3:57 Last part and coda (A''): The A section returns with some registeral change, then gets more agitated. 4:29 is the climax of the piece which is my favourite too, I like the agitation in it. 4:47 starts the coda and finally the mood cools down and ends in tonic major. I played the recording myself. I do make one major slip in 3:22 but the recording is otherwise good enough for me. Feel free to leave comment below! Henry

Ok, thank you for your feedback.

@AngelCityOutlaw, this is a just for fun event which is why we are ok with the submission. Also, Vonias is being very clear about his submission being AI generated or assisted. We'd love for you to be a part of this event, but of course its up to you. You can change your mind any time, we just want to keep things festive and fun on YC!