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Maarten Bauer

[DISCUSSION] The role of contemporary?

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I think the role of art is to project our sense of meaning into the universe, thus making our environment more legitimately meaningful. It (among many other things) is proving that an imagined sense of meaning is a real one.

I also believe that creating something tangible that makes you feel something, and then showing it to others and it makes them feel something, is almost like emotional telepathy. It is a much more direct mode of emotional communication than anything else. As humans we know meaning when we see it, it's an instinctual spiritual yearning, it is a bittersweet feeling of something greater than yourself. It makes you cry, and you don't know why. That is why I love music, because it is much bigger than the person who wrote it.

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53 minutes ago, Tónskáld said:

Lol, the equivalent of a user-deleted post.

 

No comment. LOL. (Aside, (no intention to derail the topic) two of my posts attempting to redress an imbalance were deleted so though I wanted to add about commercial purpose here, decided I wouldn't !)

Edited by Quinn
because I can. - Art.

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1 minute ago, Quinn said:

No comment. LOL. (Aside, (no intention to derail the topic) two of my posts attempting to redress an imbalance were deleted so though I wanted to add about commercial purpose here, decided I wouldn't contribute any more!). 

I read the post before you "deleted" it. I thought it was on point.

1 hour ago, Left Unexplained said:

I think the role of art is to project our sense of meaning into the universe, thus making our environment more legitimately meaningful. It (among many other things) is proving that an imagined sense of meaning is a real one.

I also believe that creating something tangible that makes you feel something, and then showing it to others and it makes them feel something, is almost like emotional telepathy. It is a much more direct mode of emotional communication than anything else. As humans we know meaning when we see it, it's an instinctual spiritual yearning, it is a bittersweet feeling of something greater than yourself. It makes you cry, and you don't know why. That is why I love music, because it is much bigger than the person who wrote it.

Well said, @Left Unexplained.

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1 hour ago, Left Unexplained said:

I think the role of art is to project our sense of meaning into the universe, thus making our environment more legitimately meaningful. It (among many other things) is proving that an imagined sense of meaning is a real one.

I also believe that creating something tangible that makes you feel something, and then showing it to others and it makes them feel something, is almost like emotional telepathy. It is a much more direct mode of emotional communication than anything else. As humans we know meaning when we see it, it's an instinctual spiritual yearning, it is a bittersweet feeling of something greater than yourself. It makes you cry, and you don't know why. That is why I love music, because it is much bigger than the person who wrote it.

 

Very true. As a medium it's a communication. 

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6 hours ago, Maarten Bauer said:

Okay, sure, but when the purpose of the artist is to create more art. What is then the purpose of art? 

 

There is none. That is the purpose of it.

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10 hours ago, Left Unexplained said:

I think the role of art is to project our sense of meaning into the universe, thus making our environment more legitimately meaningful. It (among many other things) is proving that an imagined sense of meaning is a real one.

I also believe that creating something tangible that makes you feel something, and then showing it to others and it makes them feel something, is almost like emotional telepathy. It is a much more direct mode of emotional communication than anything else. As humans we know meaning when we see it, it's an instinctual spiritual yearning, it is a bittersweet feeling of something greater than yourself. It makes you cry, and you don't know why. That is why I love music, because it is much bigger than the person who wrote it.

 

Exactly. I think art should move us or avoke thoughts and emotions, it is often the ultimate and best way to achieve this through art. 

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18 hours ago, Maarten Bauer said:

What is then the purpose of art?

Why, to be created by the artist of course!

 

Why does art need to have a "purpose"? Do clouds or the ocean have a "purpose"? We can fit them inside a chain of events, OK, but they themselves are just acts of nature that don't have a "reason" to be, or a "role" to play. I posit that people's creations work in the same manner, and that asking if it has a role is solely dependent on the person who made the individual work since, as a whole, they're just like a force of nature that doesn't need a reason to be or exist at all, it just does.

 

I mean people can get moved emotionally by a nice looking sunset or any other randomly-generated nature vista, why is art any different? In the end the most important part is the person experiencing the art itself, not the work in a vacuum.

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15 minutes ago, SSC said:

Why, to be created by the artist of course!

Why does art need to have a "purpose"? Do clouds or the ocean have a "purpose"? We can fit them inside a chain of events, OK, but they themselves are just acts of nature that don't have a "reason" to be, or a "role" to play. I posit that people's creations work in the same manner, and that asking if it has a role is solely dependent on the person who made the individual work since, as a whole, they're just like a force of nature that doesn't need a reason to be or exist at all, it just does.

I mean people can get moved emotionally by a nice looking sunset or any other randomly-generated nature vista, why is art any different? In the end the most important part is the person experiencing the art itself, not the work in a vacuum.

 

Actually I was more aiming at what Marsbars statement.
Here we arrive at the point of beliefs in which we disagree, but still can discuss about.
I believe that your comparison to natural phenomenons and art is an understandable one, yet false in my eyes.

Art is something somehow organised / controlled / structuralised / realised by human beings. A sunset can be beautiful, can avoke emotions, but not everything that moves us is art.
In fact, I believe that everything that we do / make / feel has a reason and thus a role. Not all reasons and roles are explainable, yet I always try to find the reason behind what I am doing. Perhaps this quest does not give me the answer, but the quest itself is sometimes more valuable than the answer itself.
Therefore, I state these questions. I do believe there is a purpose in art, because we make it. Why would we make something that does not have a purpose?

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9 minutes ago, Maarten Bauer said:

Art is something somehow organised / controlled / structuralised / realised by human beings.

Or not. You can assign that label to basically anything, which is why I don't like it. It's a semantics discussion which is pointless because it always results in the same thing: People have different definitions and they are not reconcilable, so the conversation goes nowhere.

11 minutes ago, Maarten Bauer said:

A sunset can be beautiful, can avoke emotions, but not everything that moves us is art.

That's a highly personal opinion, I'm sure you recognize that. I know plenty of people who think the exact opposite, as well.

12 minutes ago, Maarten Bauer said:

In fact, I believe that everything that we do / make / feel has a reason and thus a role.

Ah, well, no. Chaos is an actual thing, and many people do things and don't know why they did them. That's not even talking about art, just in life in general. You can try to say things have a role, but sometimes they may not. You even say yourself:

14 minutes ago, Maarten Bauer said:

Perhaps this quest does not give me the answer, but the quest itself is sometimes more valuable than the answer itself.

So, what's the difference between not getting an answer and there not being one to begin with anyway? Plus, this is already on shaky ground when talking about aleatory music, process music, AI-made stuff, etc. Sure, you can say there was still a person with the intention to do something, yeah, but their influence can be minimal or negligible at best.

18 minutes ago, Maarten Bauer said:

I do believe there is a purpose in art, because we make it. Why would we make something that does not have a purpose?

I think that you can look at human history and see more than enough actions and things that people have done that have no purpose and were not even conceived with a purpose. Again, chaos is a real thing in our lives, like it or not. This is also ignoring things people have done in altered states of mind (drug, sickness, etc) which will give you a pretty unsatisfying "reason" to exist, when one is given at all.

 

Thinking that people are that logical and reasonable at all times is giving humanity way too much credit.

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What's forgotten is its social and economic relevance. It supports a host of musical/cultural eunuchs that probably way outnumber artists/composers: the critics; musicologists; historians, etc., people who've never composed anything worthwhile but feel a need to cling on all the same. At any level it's an industry. "Classical" is a bit of a by-water these days but it still comes down to money aside from a few aficionados who try to keep it going on a voluntary basis.

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